News: TOUR Notes
November 23 2011
10:15 am
Westwood rejoining PGA TOUR in 2012
Lee Westwood announced Wednesday that he will rejoin the PGA TOUR for the 2012 season.
“I missed THE PLAYERS Championship last year when watching it on television,” said Westwood, also a member of the European Tour. “It was always a scheduling issue for me. Though the rules changed making it exempt from PGA TOUR restrictions, I had already set my schedule for later in the year in Asia. I didn’t want to break any of those commitments.”
The move will allow Westwood, who was last a member of the TOUR in 2008, to play in THE PLAYERS Championship, which he missed this year due to scheduling complications, and participate in the PGA TOUR Playoffs for the FedExCup for the first time.
“It’s a great event and one I’ve always enjoyed playing,” said Westwood, the third-ranked player in the world. “It just felt right in Ryder Cup year to commit to a full program in the United States. The FedExCup looked pretty good on TV this year. I thought it would be great to give it a go, having never taken part.”
Westwood will begin his 2012 in the U.S. at the World Golf Championships-Accenture World Match Play in Arizona in February, which will be the first of at least 15 starts on the TOUR for Westwood.
“We are delighted to welcome back Lee as a member of the PGA TOUR,” PGA TOUR Executive Vice President and Chief of Operations Andy Pazder said. “He’s obviously proven himself to be one of the very best and most consistent players in the world, and the fans of the PGA TOUR will enjoy having more opportunities to watch him compete.”
In 10 starts on TOUR as a non-member this year, Westwood had three top-10s, including a tie for third at the U.S. Open. He last won on TOUR in 2010 when he captured the St. Jude Classic for his first victory on TOUR since 1998.
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Hope to see him lose to Tiger – The Europeans talked too much last year. Now for some pay back. Westwood will not win a Major in 2012. Finally he has realized that the money and fame is here in US.
gwan Westwood, show them whos boss.
Welcome
Not much of a choice, as if you’re going to play with the big boys, you have to come over to the PGA Tour. Pretty soon, the Euro Tour will be lead by Simon Dyson. Can you imagine? The Asian Tour will soon have the second best players competing, and then it’ll probably be the Nationwide Tour….
…and the States will still keep losing to the Europeans in the Ryder Cup. Tee hee!
How come McDowell and McIlroy are representing Ireland and not Northern Ireland? England, Scotland and Wales have teams, why not NI?
Would USA pick Weir and Ames for their team?
Gail, are you serious about “coming over to play with the big boys”. World Number 1 – European, World Number 2 European and European Tour Member, oh yeah and he set a gzillion records winning ‘your Open’, World number 3 – European… shall I go on. By the, Simon Duson number 32 in the world… Tiger Woods is….. that’s right staring hard at his old caddie whilst scrapping a solitary point in the PC. Why can’t you just say… great news to have former world number 1 and all round good guy Lee Westwood on our Tour for a year. Think before you speak…. rant over.
p.s. 3 Majors and The Players Championship held by non Americans…..
It will be great to have Lee play more over here. Let’s hope that Rory and Martin follow suit and join our tour.
p.p.s. 21 of the top 50 in the world play the European Tour! 4 of the top 10 and 8 of the top 20…. not bad for little old Europe eh!
Don’t rip Lee for coming to play. Great to have the Euros here and a player like Westwood
Thanks Bronwen. personally can I say that I hope Luke Donald sets the record and can win the Money List both sides of ‘the pond’. This will hopefully show that golf is truly a world game and should be played by everyone everywhere.
Cheers Buck… lets have more like that. We love it when your guys come over, Mickleson commits to the Scottish Open every year prior to playing The Open Championship. We really appreciate it.
Re: robert
Because the border doesn’t exist in Ireland for many sports. Golf, Rugby, Irish Football and Hurling, Cricket etc are all played as just Ireland and players North and South of the border play together as 1 team.
…
Lee’s a nice guy, and seems like his pumping himself up for next year. If he can get his short game going he’ll certainly keep his pockets filled.
We enjoyed watching him in Ohio, and he was very respectful to all the fans.
OK fellow Golfers I hope everyone has a Great Thanksgiving Holiday.
…
Peter… Don’t worry about Gail, everything she says is verbal diarreha. She doesn’t understand that Westwood and McIlroy will play on both tours, just like all the other European players on the PGA Tour, we have truly world players unlike 95% of Americans… I predict 10 or more wins on the PGA Tour next year for Europe plus the Ryder Cup… She also has the cheek to slag of Simon Dyson when he’s 32nd in the world, 19 places ahead of Tiger Woods.
Peter – of the top 20 in the world, 9 American’s, 7 European’s. It is actually quite even. Europeans definitely have the upper hand with the top 4 in the world but the USA is probably a bit deeper going through the top 50 or even top 100 in the world. American golf is not as bad as lots of people make it out to be.
April 10th, 2011 6:50 am
Too big of a lead for Rory at this point, so I guess I need to congratulate him on his first major. Well played, and I’m sure he’ll win a bunch. All of Europe should be proud when he takes the victory walk up #18…
Ryan – but its not as dominate as people like gail want to believe either. The PGA tour is probably deepr in talent then the Euro Tour but at the top end they are equal.
April 10th, 2011 12:47 pm
C’mon Jason…you know as well as I do that it’s over. No one with this much talent, this much hype, could possibly lose a lead like this. It’s not possible, and I’m wondering why anyone would even watch, except to crown the new champion….
Scott, I totally agree. Maybe 20, even 15 years ago, PGA Tour was the dominant tour. Not the case today as top 4 in the world are all European Tour players but PGA Tour fields are probably a bit deeper towards the back end. I am just glad Golf Channel covers European Tour events as they are great to watch!
Is Westwood finally giving up on trying to push European golf over the top?
I got as good laugh this year when I went to the European Tour site where they claimed to be the best tour in the world.
June 20th, 2011 9:10 am
Awesome performance! Not sure that there’s any player alive that could have done that for 4 rounds. Congratulations…super job!!
June 21st, 2011 6:59 pm
I speak the truth, and if you disagree, you can’t handle it. I’m sure we’ll have some nice conversations going forward.
Oh great, maybe he can win a 3rd event. Wow. I don’t know why you guys talk about Westwood and Woods in the same conversation. 14 Majors to zip. I don’t care if you are or have been number 1 in the World.
Lee is the greatest european golfer of the last decade, his 20 wins and lot of runnerups in major mean something ! And he’ll win a major soon, after all Darren Clarke did…I even agree with Chubby Chandler when he says Westy wins 3 or 4 of them
shaun^^ hello again.
of cuz english is my 2nd language as you know it right away.im ready to learn with you how to writing n discussing english.^^ also, about the pgatour, eurotour.by the way happy thanks giving^^
You guys have it exactly right…when the historians look at the players in this era, I fully expect that it’ll be guys like Dyson or Westwood that are discussed, and then they’ll talk about Tiger. C’mon man….I understand you trying to defend where you live but who do you hold up as someone to discuss? Monty with zero majors? Lee with zero majors? “Rors” with one on a track that was so rain-soaked, it played like the Justin Timberlake Open? The only player worth discussing if Sir Foldo, and he’s in the discussion with guys like Johnny Miller and Ernie Els. Afetr him, we talk about only the great American players like Trevino, Hogan, Watson, Nelson, Woods, Nicklaus, etc… Then we add one South African, who was also terrific. Euros aren’t even in the discussion, although I will concede that they say that the game was invented there. Surprising they’re not better at it if that’s the case…
are you there shaun^^
i would love to discuss with you about tw.
Seve is a LEGEND!!
Lee has won the 9th most tournaments on the Euro tour
By the way Frenchie… you reiterate the absolute most typical Euro comment. “Lots of runnerups in majors mean something.” Not to the Americans, as second place means you lost. Until guys like Westwood and Donald realize that regardless of World Ranking points awarded for top ten finishes, winning is what matters, they’ll most likely continue to lose. Any idea how many “runner up” finishes Michael Phelps has had in swimming? How about Federer in tennis? Didn’t think so….
gail you are so full of it. How many times over the last two years have american been scream how great tiger did because he finished 4th here and 3rd there. Americans care just as much about top tens as any european.
What’s up hotwater? Good to hear from you again… what do you want speak about? not just Tiger, we can speak about anything, it doesn’t even need to be about golf. Where are you from?
Scott…Tiger is the one that WINS all the majors, remember? No one ever talks about his 4ths or 3rds. Oh, maybe with the exception of the chick, Ian Poulter, who GUARANTEED Tiger wouldn’t make the top 5 in the Masters last year when he finished 4th. Another bright Brit….
Forgot Woodland 0.
shaun^^ thank you so much for replied me. i appreciate.im from cal. my heritage is korea. i enjoy reading this site n i know that
what is wrong n what is right when they rant over some subject.^^ and i found that you have a very good prospect of golf. that’s why i want talk to you about golf. im very slow for the tapping. happy thanks giving again^^
When did Woods last win a Major Gail? If you think he wins them ALL.
By the way, I do think that Westwood seems to be a nice guy, and unlike “Rors,” Poulter, McDowell, etc…, has taken the high road when asked about other players rather than running his mouth and making stupid comments. When he and Luke win their first major, they’ll be tied with Todd Hamilton, Ben Curtis, and Mark Brooks. If they ever get two, they’ll be in the company of John Daly. Until then, I guess we’ll continue to count their top tens….
I agree, the europeans don’t have many majors. Just don’t forget to include Padraig Harrington into the discussion about faldo, he won 3 majors in a little over a year, pretty well done. Think Langer is in that category too, although he’s not active anymore, as well as Seve. I’ve often thought they should move one more of the majors to Europe, but then you realize that the majority of major winners (well maybe not if you also count intl, but you get my point) are americans. Maybe it’s coinciding with the fact that they have home crowd more times, but really I don’t think so..
looks like british domination next year on tour hahaha gail u need to wake up and see us players are no longer a force like before
Numo…some great points, and Harrington is a nice guy (although he’s probably done), but if the home crowd was such an advantage why would Nicklaus, Watson, Tiger, etc… have won so many majors on foreign soil? I think the answer is simply that they’re better players, and weren’t happy to merely show up and try for a “top ten.” Jack had a boatload of top finishes but like Tiger, discounts them as losses. Until the Euros show the intestinal fortitude to close and win, they’ll always be discussed at the end of every conversation. They need fire in the belly, not in their mouth or their backside…
gail… im from england and i love watching both tours, the pga tour is my favourite tour to watch. however there is no denying that there is also a great standard within the european tour! and as for your rant about who will be remembered by historians… i think a certain name (SEVE) will no doubt spring to mind for his haul of 5 majors, no1 player in the world and his inspirational play in the ryder cup!! gail think before you open ur mouth..
Thank You for those kind words hotwater.
I like to talk about FACTS and realistic prospects for the future of golf… not like some of these nutjobs that cling on to past glory’s and rejoice Tiger Woods like he is God.. ie Gail.
You should be proud of Korean Golf.. the way it has developed over the past 10 years is fantastic… KJ Choi is a credit to your country and the game, Y.E Yang a Major Champion, Kim and Noh stars of the future.. exciting times for Korean Golf.
We know about Thanks Giving in Britain but don’t celebrate it, however have a good one.
Poor Peter Griffin, two good years and he thinks the Euros are tops, pretty easy to rack up OWGR points when about the ten same guys are the only ones to have a chance to win every week…and how many first time winners on TOUR this year? Don’t worry Peter only 200 plus majors to go until your comments become legitimate.
lenny…why is it that every Euro talks about the Ryder Cup like it’s a major instead of an exhibition? I don’t prognosticate, I don’t guess who will win, but rather I use FACTS to give my opinion. When Tiger won all his majors, not only did he hit it great, but his short game was the best by far, challenged only by Mickelson, period. Rory’s short game isn’t even in the top 50, maybe even the top 100 of elite players, so to discuss him like he’s Tiger after a rain-soaked Open is ludicrous. Look at the Masters, starting at hole #1, when he had to get the ball up and down from tough positions. Donald has an awesome short game, maybe the best right now, and is a great iron player. Still, he’s a poor driver and not long, so to compare him is also wrong. Bottom line, I don’t think Tiger’s a good guy, but he’s a great player, and to ask “when did he win his last major?” is one of the dumbest posts I’ve heard. Let’s watch it play out, but if you look at the dates where folks have put my previous April posts up now, you can see how sarcastically I knew “Rors” wouldn’t win at Augusta…
@Gail… British Golf fans are real golf fans the best and the most knowledgable in the World… Not like you rowdy Yanks that try to put Europeans off if there in with a chance of winning. for example… Colin Montgomerie. Why did you guys hate him so much?
Kaymer’s third shot in the play-off at the 2010 USPGA someone shouted GET IN THE WATER!!
Bang out off order in my opinion.
Ok Gail let’s try to do it your way and forget the brits…ever heard of Martin Kaymer ? The guy shot a 59 in q-school, won twice his rookie year, at least twice every year since, including a major and WGC…do you think he’s a guy that never closes on a win ? Oh, sorry I forgot, obviously big Bubba won the PGA in playoff last year…as did Dustin Johnson at the 2010 US open or at this year Open, or TW at the Masters..great american wins all of them
shaun^^
i thought you were at somewhere in the east coast usa. it’s my pleasure talk to you. golf is certain global sports, we don’t need that im right n you wrong. i enjoy the watching all the great players from all of the world.shaun have a great one, i will say hi to you nexttime if i cu here. thanks again^^
Shaun…”rowdy yanks”? You’re the one calling me an idiot and telling me to shut up, and we’re rowdy. You don’t even have manners. Concerning Monty, he’s a pompous fool hears things that aren’t even said, and is the perfect example of why many people don’t think golfers are athletes. Concerning Martin Kaymer, I don’t care what he did in Q-School, but like Luke Donald, who played collegiate golf at Nortwestern, Kaymer knows he needs to be in the USA to play with the best, which is why he’s a member at Whisper Rock in Arizona. A lot of the members tell me he’s a terrific guy, and I wouldn’t be surprised if he got his US citizenship. I actually agree with comments about Bubba and Johnson, as Watson is fundamentally shaky and as I posted during the PC, if Dustin had a brain like Woods he’d already have 2-3 majors. Who’s saying they’re the best players in the world? Not me, although if you want, I’ll start counting their top tens….
Shaun…one other comment…I do agree that European golf fans who attend tournaments do seem to be knowledgeable, although that’s negated by the postings here, many of which are some of the dumbest I’ve heard. Next time we’re talking about the fans instead of the players, I’ll be sure to give them credit…
Gail… You must have a short memory. the 1999 Ryder Cup was a farce on the last day, Monty was the subject of abuse! I agree with you on one thing.. Monty could have conducted himself better on the course but of it he is an absalute Gent and he’s very funny too.
US citzenship for Kaymer… don’t think so, he’s not a traitor.
When are you ever going to say something Valid?
Gail, your comments show such ignorant arrogance. You clearly like Tiger, as do I, and I think he’s arguably the best golfer ever, but he is an anomaly, and his success does not represent all American golfers. Over the past 5 years, US golfers have won 7 majors and Euro golfers have won 7 majors. American golf has the best development system, and the college golf system, so it will naturally produce more professional golfers (not to mention the population of USA is almost 6 times that of any European country). But amongst the top golfers there is no basis (relying on current facts, not citing the likes of Hagen, Jones, Nicklaus, etc) to say Americans are better than Europeans or any other country. There are just more of them.
Gail, find something else to do.. You are not a golf savant. Your opinions are too loud.
C’mon Gail, you’re better than that. This just sounds like sour grapes. As if your scorned that there wasn’t enough Guinness in Ireland to get the euros drunk enough to sleep with you. But, we know TW will sleep with anything so you have that going for you… Where was I going with this, oh yeah, good luck with all that golf talk – a tad boring if you ask me.
Hope he speeds his play up a bit..The last time I saw him around the greens, the grass grew two inches before he putted out !!
Nice job Harry….once again, if you have nothing intelligent to say, make it personal. To be honest, no one has a valid retort to any of my comments, so instead of a debate, it’s that the US has so many people and an advanced collegiate system. Of course there’s no discussion of the “schools” that are offered in many countries where youngsters live there, learn there, and play there, because that wouldn’t bolster your argument. I guess the fact that the US has always had the best players, even though the game wasn’t invented here, is based on anomalies. Funny, there seems to be a lot of those anomalies in America and not a lot of those in Europe. The best comment, however, is the consideration that Kaymer would be a “traitor” if he asked for US citizenship, just because he finds a country club in Arizona as the best place to improve his game. Do you guys read what you write before you submit it, or just hit the button? Your comments are priceless!!
Priceless!!!! That’s Awesome!!! And here I thought I was just adding my two cents. Gail, this continues to demonstrate that you are a poor judge of value…
gail, enough people have shown you that the Europeans and the european tour is just as skilled, at the highest level, as americans and the PGA Tour. Its you who continues to argue with no valid retort to their comments.
Thanks gail i came up with the traitor comment. Germany is a beautiful country you know.. the only reason so many Europeans are members of clubs in America is because of the harsh winters we get in Europe… more chance to practise in warmer conditions over the winter months instead of hitting balls of snow.
True shaun I’m actually living in Germany and the only bad thing there is precisely that you can’t play golf on proper courses in winter ! Concerning “schools”, it’s true that Nationwide Tour prepares young players better for PGA tour than Challenge Tour does for European tour…proof with the Keegan Bradley, Jonny Vegas, Brendan Steele, while no graduate from 2010 challenge tour won in 2011. i think the courses on Nationwide are closer to those on PGA tour, so the players are more prepared…while those from challenge tour play in Kazakhstan or in Russia, on course that have really nothing similar to those they will play on Euro tour. that’s a problem Mr. O’grady should think about
Scott…I’ll be specific so there’s no question as to what I mean. When you say that “enough people have shown you that the Europeans and European Tour is just as skilled,” exactly what measurement are you using, as this is the basis for the disagreement. Euros will want to use Ranking points as a barometer for greatness, and I think it’s wins. You tout guys like Donald and Westwood that have zero majors, and others like Rory and Kaymer and McDowell that have one. I’ve given you a list of others that have one, like Hamilton, Brooks and Curtis, and I wouldn’t really consider them “at the highest level,” to use your words. No one should be considered the best at ANY sport if they haven’t dominated major events. Can you imagine Michael Phelps with zero gold medals being considered the best swimmer, or Armstrong with nothing at the Tour de France? Would Nadal or Federer be the best tennis players with zero wins in Grand Slam events? NO WAY, which is why considering golfers differently is the true anomaly. Please, don’t keep telling me how close they were when they lost, or how they almost did it, or how they’ll do it in the future. Show me the wins. I truly think that because Americans value wins and little else, it’s the reason they do win. Until the Euros have the stomach for it, I don’t expect much. I do love, however, that Harry posts as “Harry P. Enis.” Need I say more about the pompous nature of the Brits?
Gail, good to see u r still doing what your insular little brain commands, talking crap. Get back into the kitchen and get my dinner on the table! You have way too much spare time and no idea what you are talking about.
Lol.
Does that make you happy??? Ahh wait, its tea time and I’m out of scones – rubbish!
Players with 5+ majors in the last 30 or so years:
Tiger Woods
Nick Faldo
Seve
Not exactly American dominance.
Top 5 Americans on the current World rankings:
#5 Steve Stricker (0 majors)
#6 Dustin Johnson (0 majors)
#9 Webb Simpson (0 majors)
#10 Matt Kuchar (0 majors)
#11 Nick Watney (0 majors)
Yet we still go on about Westwood not having a major…..look at the amount of players that still don’t have one. He’ll have more chances.
Well known American golfers with 1 major:
Fred Couples
Lanny Wadkins
Tom Lehman
David Toms
Hal Sutton
Tom Weiskopf
Justin Leonard
David Duval
Corey Pavin
Tom Kite
Jim Furyk
Craig Stadler
All that talent and not a single multiple major winner among them.
I figured why not just one more before signing off… Happy day of glutony you wankers!!!
It’s very easy using Tod Hamilton and Shaun Micheel when making a point about having 1 major, gail. How about mentioning some of the above players when you try to make the same point? Might make you look a bit less stupid
Mr Logic, i’m loving your stats, well said mate.
Davis Love III 1 Major…Olly has 2, 1 up to Europe.
jason is really nice guy…. wow, have a nice day
mr.nice jason.
30+ years? We know Jack won in 1986. Trevino won the PGA in 1984, and Watson won in 1980, 81, 82, 83. After that, considering Tiger won almost 3X the amount that you’re considering for your minimum criteria, there’s plenty of dominance. The reason we talk about Westwood is because the guy is 38 years old, and you’re comparing him to guys in their mid-20′s. Are you serious?The hilarious part is that Shaun, the genius, say “I’m loving your stats.” C’mon…. You’re not really doing this with a straight face, are you? Geez….
Looks like Lee wants to to head to head with a healthy Tiger. CANT WAIT!
Tiger = 14
Seve = 5
Faldo= 6
You can throw in Paddy to tie if you want.
In the last 30 or so years I said Gail. Nicklaus only won 1 major in that period. Same for Trevino. Watson won 4 (under the criteria). Tiger did dominate, but one player dominating does not equate to a country dominating. Spain didn’t dominate the Euro Tour in the 70s/80s, Seve did.
Also, I’m not defending Westwood’s career at all. He hasn’t won the big tournaments like he should have. I’m just pointing out that your “perhaps he will win one and join the likes of Shaun Micheel and Todd Hamilton” is the most flawed argument I have ever seen. How about “perhaps he will win one and join the likes of Freddy Couples and Tom Lehman”? You cant pick out the 2 most notable flukes of recent years to try and make a point.
But please continue using a flawed argument. Don’t let me stop you.
JC…I’m loving your stats…well said, mate. The beautiful argument is the one made by Mr Illogic, who compares Webb Simpson with Lee Westwood. Since Webb has probably played in maybe a handful (or less), he’ll have about 45 more starts in majors before he’s the same age as Westwood is now, and Mr. Illogic uses him as an example. You can’t dream this stuff up! Wondering if these guys are serious, as if they are, it boggles the mind as to how they exist in this world with that level of common sense and reasoning…
Using a once in a lifetime player (Tiger) to justify AMERICAN DOMINANCE OF MAJORS is ridiculous to be quite honest.
How about different major winners in the last 5 years:
USA: 6
Europe: 5
Internationals: 5
Pretty tight lately if you ask me.
Gail, I also mentioned Steve Strickers 0 majors at the age of 44, but you happily chose to ignore that.
Your arguments are flawed and you constantly choose to ignore any logic.
Have any comments about “American hero” Steve Strickers lack of majors? Well?
Gail.. you must love all this attention from the male posters, you obviously don’t get it in real life.
Mr Illogic…any more comparisons? Maybe you want to tell us that Peter Uihlein, who won a US Amateur, hasn’t won a major so you want to compare him with Colin Montgomerie? At least wait until he graduates college to make the comparison. And you say in your post that I might look a little less stupid? Got any mirrors where you live?
Gail, we all know your type.
Here’s your logic:
PGA Tour > All other Tours
American Golfers > All other golfers
Wins by American golfers > Wins by anyone else
Great comeback Shaun! You’re really on a roll now! After you hook up with Hotwater (and Jason makes three), give me a call….
Gail,
Please tell me where I made any comparisons that were anywhere as absurd as yours.
Perhaps you should compare Shaun Micheel to Freddy Couples, since they have had equal careers.
I don’t get the “flag waving” mentality. I love to watch great golf. I wish all the top players on both the European and PGA tours would play all over the world.
For me, the best tournaments are the majors and the WGC events because then we get to see all of the world’s best competing head-to-head.
The ONLY time I care about the nationality of a professional golfer is during the Ryder Cup matches when I wholeheartedly cheer for my U.S.A. team. Other than that…. I don’t care one bit what a golfer’s nationality is.
Great news that Lee is re-joining the PGA tour. I can’t wait to see him in the FedEx Cup playoffs next year.
I used to be a huge Tiger fan until the “Scandal.” Now? Not as much, but I would like to see him get back in the mix because I still like to see him play when he is playing well. I also am thrilled about all the young players coming up. Keegan Bradley, Rory, Ryo, Jason Day, Adam Scott and on and on the list goes.
Just give me great golf to watch .. that’s all that matters.
The PGA Tour is greater than all others. Its just a fact. Week in and week out, the PGA Tour typically has the strongest field. There are exceptions many weeks, but overall, the PGA TOUR is where the top players play the most. Is it not? It’s as simple as that. Now, that does not mean that the European Tour or the Australasian Tour, blah blah, cannot create great players. It just means, for now, until golf becomes a completely global sport, the best players still come to America to compete. The simple fact that all the best international players have set up in the US to play the PGA Tour, not the European Tour. Of, course, finally, just the fact that so many more Europeans play the US Tour than vica versa, how is Gail wrong? The PGA Tour is the strongest Tour. Anyone questioning that is just dense.
I look forward to coming onto this site during The Masters next year and seeing 1 of 2 things:
1) An American is winning through 2 rounds and gail is praising him and saying this will be the start of many majors for him
2) A Non-American is winning and gail is posting about “how she doesn’t believe he has it in him to finish this off”
And this is coming from a California guy!!
Actually Aaron Smith, 3 of the worlds top 4 played mostly on the Euro Tour this season, since they decided not to join the PGA Tour.
So, “overall, the PGA TOUR is where the top players play the most” is not factually correct at all
It always disappoints me when I see posts like gails on this site. Makes me ashamed to be an American golf fan.
I just wanna make you wet
Thanks Aaron…finally someone comes forth with some reality, and then Banjo does the same thing that all the Euros do…try and prognosticate what is going to happen in the future with no knowledge of it at all. Must be from San Francisco….
Completely off topic, but I’m just wondering how many majors did Phil Mickelson play in before winning his first major, and how many has Westwood played?
1999 order of merit
europe (monti) : …$
usa (tiger) : …$
who would have earned more, taking into account the tournaments tiger woods played, which count/ would have counted on the european TOUR??
Question: Lefty played in 46 before winning his first (AKA he won his 47th)
Westwood has played in 55
Once again people bring up Tiger to justify bringing down Europeans.
Here’s some logic for everyone, compare Tiger to ANYONE (except Jack) and they will come up well short.
Gail… Even your own people are turning you, that’s because most of us think you are delusional.
gail – Sure you have to look at wins. If you take the players from the last ryder cup you have the USA with a total of 224 career wins and the Europeans with 164 career wins. Now if you take the highest and lowest performers for each group, since those are the extremes and don’t make up a true comparison, you have the USA with 127 wins and the europeans with 125 wins. It seems to me that they are pretty close.
gail – Sure you have to look at wins. If you take the players from the last ryder cup you have the USA with a total of 224 career wins and the Europeans with 164 career wins. Now if you remove the highest and lowest performers for each group, since those are the extremes and don’t make up a true comparison, you have the USA with 127 wins and the europeans with 125 wins. It seems to me that they are pretty close.
Look at the title of this article. No surprise that Westwood is coming back to the PGA tour. Why? Because that’s where the real excitement and competition is… And no, I am not a US citizen, but you just can’t become well-known by staying in the Euro Tour all your career. As for the debate about wins, sure, consistency is one of the most important things in golf; as a matter of fact, in any sport. HOWEVER, like all sports, that doesn’t get you anywhere if you don’t win. You won’t have a “highlight” of your career; you’ll probably only get remembered for your chokes instead of your success.
Aaron Smith – How many of the top golfers hold European tour cards?
As a statistical analyst myself, it is always important to note that exceptional figures should always be removed when running an analysis comparing 2 different populations. I was pleasently surprised to read your post, Scott. A man after my own heart.
I dunno Dan, I managed it pretty well
Wasn’t gail the poster who stated in every Tour Report for like a month after The Masters that Rory would never recover from that choke?
Mr. Logic – so true..thanks.
fellas , i´m just curious to get something right.
luke donald on the verge of leading the money list on both tours. fine. what about 1999??
good to see that he wants PGA full time – another good player to see… its going to be the best year of golf 2012.. go Tiger!!!
@Seve – Obviously, look at your amount of wins, as well as your wins in majors. Not all Euro players do that. Compare 10 wins in the PGA tour with 10 wins in the Euro tour. Who’s more likely to be better known around the world?
I’m sure Tiger would have done it 3 or 4 times if he had joined the Euro Tour. However he didnt so the point is…pointless
Most well known players with 10 wins on Euro Tour: Sergio Garcia and Martin Kaymer
Most well known players with 10 wins on PGA Tour: Larry Nelson and Dave Stockton
Dan – if you are going by the number of countries they will be known in….I would think the person with the 10 euro tour wins will be better known. If you are going by the total number of people I would say the person with the PGA Tour wins.
^^
What Scott just said
GAIL if you take tiger out of the equasion,i would hate to be hanging by my nuts waiting fot the next big thing to come out off usa.take him out of the past and it doesn’t look good either. the disscusion would probably be how close ernie is to jacks record.at this point in time ;WITHOUT TIGER ; its clearly r.o.w. 1ST usa 2ND imo.cheers.
@Scott – Yes, I am going by the total number of people. Garcia played on the PGA tour, and was successful at such a young age. Same goes for Kaymer, but in addition to that, he was #1 for abit.
HAO – and the sad thing is Ernie is still 33 career wins behind tiger.
Everytime an American plays on the European Tour they struggle FACT!
Scott…did you and Mr Illogic factor in that the Ryder Cup has “Captain’s Picks” included? Therefore, it was possible to have 4 golfers in the analysis that wouldn’t belong by any other reasonable measurement. If you look at the recent President’s Cup, Robert Allenby had no business being on the team based on performance, but was included based on his knowledge of the golf course. Wouldn’t your analysis been more statistically valid if you removed the 4 picks and used the other 20 players? Then, if you remove the extreme, you have a better sample. Surprised Mr Illogic wouldn’t have thought of that, considering he’s a statistical analyst…
pm… Monty won the Order of Merit in 1999.. What’s your point?
Hao…glad to see you’re in the discussion, as at least you have an understanding of the game. Ernie would have been a big benefactor if Tiger was out, but Phil would have been as well. The huge issue with your position is without Tiger, who has the ability to close the deal on Sunday and actually win, versus the usual top ten. Would that have been Ernie? Phil? Without Tiger at Pebble in 2000, does Jimenez win? All subjective viewpoints, but I’d rather deal on what we know, and that is that we have players who we put at the top of the heap that have never won a major. I can’t think of another individual sport where you can whiff on every big event and still be ranked #1. It makes no sense….
Gail… Change your tune it’s getting really boring now.
Anybody got good odds on Tiger Woods winning the Grand Slam next year?… I’m thinking of going down to the Bookies to put a bet on tomorrow.
then don´t talk or write about luke donald being the first to win both orders of merit. it´s absurd. common sense! one doesn´t have to be a member on both tours to win the order of merit. Just win golf events, and be on top in both !!!
Gail…first off the Euro team only got three picks and the usa team got four picks so you can’t just remove the picks from it but for giggles lets just take out the picks and the lowest qualifier for the euro team. The USA would have 116 career wins and the euro would have 114 career wins….still pretty darn close. You definitely can’t say Americans strive for winning more.
Gail “that’s negated by the postings here, many of which are some of the dumbest I’ve heard”
That’s rich coming from you. You used to be the most prolific poster on this site. Day after day,week after week EVERY post revolved round your deep seated hatred of foreigners.
Sorry you are back.
gail, how about tennis?
Female #1 Caroline Wozniacki has been #1 for well over a year and has 0 grand slams.
Or Soccer, In the FIFA World Rankings the Netherlands were #1 2 months ago despite never winning a World Cup, or winning a major tournament in the last 23 years.
Winning majors has a lot to do with peaking at the right time and also requires a fair bit of luck. That’s why it took a player as talented as Phil Mickelson until the age of 34 to win a major.
pm… The trouble is a well known American has never held a European Tour card, so it would be impossible for an American to win the money list on both tours. World adventure is exciting… but not for American golfers it seems.
Fiveball…I have no hatred of foreigners, and worked for a British company. I have a disdain, however, for anyone, especially professional athletes, who feel the need to “chirp” about the failures of others and take advantage of rough situations. Specifically, I couldn’t stand the comments from McIlroy, McDowell, Poulter, etc… concerning Woods, his actions, his golf game, his return, etc…, expecially because he’s the guy that single-handedly raised the game to it’s recent level, and gave them much greater opportunities for income, endorsements, etc… Sure, he’s a terrible guy, a bad father and husband, but they have no business talking about the one person that paved the way for the profession that they’ve chosen as theirs. So, when you want to talk about hatred and what’s “rich,” try and explain why these guys, as pros, should say anything other than “I don’t know and I wish him the best.” Too bad you don’t see that, but I can’t say I’m surprised…
Scott…Europe only has 2 picks for 2012. They always have an advantage.
Mr Illogic….soccer isn’t an individual sport, and we were talking about the elite in their sports, like Phelps, Armstrong, Federer, Nadal, and Tiger. Wozniacki is no where in that discussion at this point, and I venture to say that most people would know Martina Navratilova and Chris Evert more than Wozniacki, and they’ve been out of the limelight for years….
so tiger woods has the european order of merit , just like mary(jesus mom) giving birth without copulating!!
Gail… Most Americans love Rory McIlroy, just accept that FACT!
pm… What are you talking about? Tiger Woods has never won the European Tour Order of Merit FACT.
pm… Speak proper English Please! You’re hard to understand.
Shaun – in 2010 the Euro team got to pick three players. I would think the USA has the advantage with 4 picks….gives you a better chance to pick some hot players.
GAIL try tennis,these other guy’s are saying they have the top 4 w/r players,you can’t argue with that. how they got there has nothing to do with it.are they super heroes to be compared to past greats seeing 2 of them have not won a major & the other 2 have {1} No.the point is there still the top 4 {its not there fault}consistency gets you up there & usa have a few up there that arn’t so crash hot either.cheers/.
shaun.. how or why has tiger not won the european order of merit??
Scott… That’s what i mean.. They as in USA always has the advantage.
pm – here are the winners of the order of merit going back to 1996.
• 1996 Colin Montgomerie
• 1997 Colin Montgomerie
• 1998 Colin Montgomerie
• 1999 Colin Montgomerie
• 2000 Lee Westwood
• 2001 Retief Goosen
• 2002 Retief Goosen
• 2003 Ernie Els
• 2004 Ernie Els
• 2005 Colin Montgomerie
• 2006 Pádraig Harrington
• 2007 Justin Rose
• 2008 Robert Karlsson
• 2009 Lee Westwood
• 2010 Martin Kaymer
don’t see tiger’s name
shaun – being from Canada I wasn’t sure who they were LOL
HAO… All your best players are past their prime, McIlroy has 10 years till he is in his prime.. FACT!
You’re a man that seems to know Tiger Woods inside out, can you give me some odds on Woods winning the Grand Slam next year.. Thinking about putting some big money on him.
top 3/ball thru 9 holes
darren clark – -3
greg norman – even
adam scott – + 5
scott has 3 birdies in that score, bubba watson is -3 thru 9.
HAO… I’m waiting on those odds?
Gail, why are you so offended by the Europeans saying stuff about Tiger? Golfers from all over the world have said things about him.
As I remember correctly, Rory only said that he is “a normal golfer like the rest of us”. Not exactly an insult. Poulter was asked did he think Tiger would finish top 5 at the masters and said “Judging on his current form I would have to say no”. That’s also a fair answer.
Not sure what Graeme McDowell said. Care to fill me in? Because I certainly can’t remember anything?
Caroline Wozniacki is the worlds 9th most marketable athlete according to a recent analysis by SportsPro Media.
The list comprises the 50 athletes deemed by SportsPro to offer value for marketing money if signed today to a long-term global endorsement deal.
http://www.sportspromedia.com/sportspro_blog/usain_bolt_is_the_worlds_most_marketable_athlete/
Anti-European… Monty praised Woods in the Scottish papers this week, he said that Tiger is’nt far away from his best form and expects a come back in 2012. The American media fail to post things like this in there papers or news.
shaun i know a * REAL GOOSE* who will take your money. he loathes tiger so you should get a good price.actually he’s from that country that bare their nuts under a skirt{scotland}. the benifit of betting with him is. it doesn’t matter if you lose the bet because it all stays in the one account.his name is ** THE LEDGENDARY SHAUN SMITH**. don’t treat him like an idiot though he once had his handicap reduced from 12 to 4 after 1 round of golf.what score do you think he had?.
Who No 1 Caroline? My guess is Lionel Messi.
stay away dude…if you dont think our tour is “as good as yours” then dont come over. i have never liked this guy…he strikes me as someone who still thinks of the USA as a colony. stay away stay away stay away
Not to mention the fact that one of Rory’s first memories of watching golf was seeing Tiger win the US Amateur. He basically worshipped him as a kid. But yet he says one thing about Tiger being just another golfer (which is exactly what he is) and he gets murdered by the American press. Same for anything else said about him by any other Non-American. If Webb Simpson or someone had said these things it wouldn’t have made the paper. American media cracks me up.
Shaun: It was Usain Bolt
HAO…I’m Shaun from Scotland, Sean Smith is the legend from England. It’s a kilt by the way and i hate them.. So itchy.. Had to wear one several times. The only down side for being Scottish. lol.. Sean must have had to shoot under net 50 for that to happen.
Excuse me Sundy.. Are you talking about Westwood here?
Anti-European… The American press like to pick up on so called negative comments on Woods. Rory was just speaking the truth and his mind… Nothing wrong with that. So was Poulter and i don’t know what McDowell has said to get in Gail’s bad books.
d clarke -4 thr/12 *t/1st. bubba -2 thr/12.
Is Darren Clarke that fella who won the european Open thingy this year? I’ve never heard of him since….is he some European?
Bubba Watson is incredible!! He will win! GET IN THE HOLE!!!!!! YEAAAAAH!!!!!!!!
gail… are u really comparing rory mcilroy to curtis because they’ve both won one major…? give the lad a chance he’s only 22 after all!! plently more oppourtunities for him in the future…
The OPEN CHAMPION is BACK!!!
Typical Yank… You just summed up a typical yank perfectly. GET IN THE HOLE!!!!!!
tiger does not have to be marketed. he shouts, not cry. he´s heard , without listening. and if he complains, it´s a win!!
Goodnight Gail.. I’ll say a prayer before i go to sleep so i don’t have any nightmares about your comments.
clarke -2/14 watson -3/15 leaders -5
You and the others are responding nicely to the conditional stimuli. Nightmares? Never! Dreams…
Australia, Brazil, Sweden, and Thailand all at -2 right now. Zimbabwe is only one back. You heard it here first…Zimbabwe is the next World Champions of Golf.
ok people , explain how to intimidate a person in a game, in which one has just got to do his business.
I can pretty much say Gail is dead on with just about all of her comments….
With all this hype…if tiger even gets back to 2009 form or better (which I think he’s at now) he’ll win a major and probably 4 or 5 tournaments..noone has been that impressive.
i´m glad, tiger & co. seam to be back again, with all the european tour members to give the game of golf a fantastic treat, and more discussion.
merry xmas + happy new 2012
adam scott 9 birdies 2 bogies 1 double 1 tripple.bubba -5*clarke -3 *leader -6.fowler ogilvy baddely day aft/group.
Gail calm down… You really are dedicating alot of time to this! Why do you hate Europeans so much? I think its great that the game is a true global game now. You have to admit most/ all but one or two of the last 8 major winners had European Tour cards when they won. I am one of the few Americans who actually doesn’t hate everything non American! Sorry Gail :/
haha poor gail!
Tiger is a straight out gangster end of story
…
Dan East, although I certainly don’t agree with you about Tiger being a “Gangster” as you say, I do believe you left out one important point in your statement.
“Tiger is a straight out gangster end of story, except he does have one hellacious golf game that no one can touch.”
Dan, you and yours have a Great Thanksgiving Day!
…
I am wondering how many wins our American players would have, including Tiger and Phil, if they had belonged to both tours, early in their careers as well as other players. Traveling back and forth across the world, playing on courses that are not as manicured as ours. Having to put up with jet lag and the bad weather on more frequently. We have seen it is not so easy, with Dustin Johnson, Bubba Watson, even Phil. Those Europeans who play on both tours do pretty well considering. ESPECIALLY LUKE DONALD! It’s a little easier to win majors on your home soil. I think Tiger would have done well, not sure about the rest.
Americas biggest export will be US dollars if to many euros join the pga tour
all pros are the same! Its all about temperament and nervs! Nothing to do with skill.
Gail has no idea and should go and do something better with her life than ruining a great story of a great player returning to the states. Billy from Australia. You want to see the best golf? Come and play on the toughest courses in the world. greens running at 14 and 15 everyday in Melbourne on our sandbelt courses!
Well I have just spent an enjoyable lunch hour reading this discussion. Gail you slug it out with the best of them, and the others. I guess you are already married – what a shame.
Seff, she’s waiting for tiger to call, always the bridesmaid.
I’m sorry I’m late to this debate but did mr logic really say that one player dominating doesn’t mean one country dominated. That could be the most oxymoronic thing I’ve ever heard. One American dominating is the same as 10 dominating. Just like if one euro dominated. Sorry tiger and Phil are from America but they are and in the last 15 years they have 18 majors.
the pig is on the spit.
All pros are the same… No skill… Boy there are some people on here that say some crazy stuff. I’m impressed that you can figure out how to use a computer or phone with a brain like that. And logic- this isn’t a science/statistical experiment this really happened so you can’t really throw tiger out of the mix unless you are trying to slant the results towards the euros.
Let’s compare America and Europe but America you can’t have tiger or jack for that matter that makes sense.
I have a feeling if tiger was from Europe you would be on Gail’s side of the argument.
And about this article isnt it obvious that Westwood wanted to play in the us but was afraid of how it would look. So he sheepishly followed rory’s lead who is the smartest one over there Who really wants to suffer through wind and rain when you have a choice.
@gail
You’re being so hypocritical it’s a skill, you were owned by Mr. Logic’s point that Couples, Love, Furyk etc have only won one major and a number of top Americans haven’t won one, then you reply by saying you can’t compare a 38-year old Westwood to a 20 something Simpson.
WELL LOOK WHAT YOU’VE BEEN DOING THE WHOLE TIME.
You’ve compared McIlroy(22)and Kaymer(26) to Woods(35) in terms of majors and tournaments won. Please tell me, I’m interested to know, how that is a fair comparison.
Here’s a fair comparison.
Majors won at 22:
McIlroy = 1
Woods =1.
Now we’re talking logically.
‘Specifically, I couldn’t stand the comments from McIlroy, McDowell, Poulter, etc… concerning Woods, his actions, his golf game, his return, etc…, expecially because he’s the guy that single-handedly raised the game to it’s recent level’
Seve made the European Tour, not Tiger.
And McDowell said nothing against Woods ever, you’re just plucking that out of God knows where. Maybe you’re confusing bad mouthing with beating in the Target World Challenge last year.
And finally, find me some quotes for McIlroy against Woods from a credible source that isn’t a tabloid newspaper putting his words out of context and I’ll agree that he badmouthed Woods.
‘Of, course, finally, just the fact that so many more Europeans play the US Tour than vica versa, how is Gail wrong?’
@aaron smith
Half the Americans wouldn’t even go to the WGC this year in Shanghai, some Americans miss the most prestigious tournament in the world, the British Open(Kenny Perry for example).
Europeans are prepared to travel to further their careers, Americans don’t want to be found out for averageness outside their own bubble(Bubba Watson missed the cut at the French Open this year on a different style course).
And another thing for gail, if Rory’s major win was on an ‘easy’ course(second longest in history), then why could none of the best established ‘top’ American golfers of the current time score better than -2 on home soil, the average sort of winning score for a tough US Open layout?
Dave… Your on form and it’s all FACTS! People like Gail, X24hot and HAO can’t accept Europran golf is far superior at the moment… Comparing McIlroy with fluke Major wins from Americans(Todd Hamilton) is absurd.
Shaun – you agree with logic’s posts? If tiger were European would you not count his dominance as European. It’s a silly statement. And why is that an absurd comparison? They both only have one major and last time I checked Hamilton and Curtis won, in your opinion, the major that means the most
I’m curious. Is there any example of an American player who has built a successful career on the Euro Tour? Wins and whatnot, not just make a living.
Dave…great post! I agree with your synopsis regarding Rory, but you have the wrong person to have an issue with. Everyone from Europe sings his praises as the next Tiger, saying he’ll break all his records. Even Harrington said something along those lines. I’ve said from the beginning that before you label him as the next greatest thing, he has to show a better short game than what I’ve seen thus far. You know as well as I do that Congressional was not playing as a US Open venue, so you didn’t have to get the ball up and down for pars, which is normally the “mantra” of a US Open. When “Rors” said he’d “fancy” playing Tiger, as would most of the guys on the Euro Ryder Cup team, he went over the line, just like he did with Jay Townsend, who was just doing his job commentating for a tournament. Tell the kid to shut up and play, and we’ll see what happens. The way Tiger is playing now, I’m looking forward to having them in the same group on a Sunday. I would expect a finish similar to what Rory showed at Augusta, with one of the biggest gags we’ve seen since Norman….
Hello there! greetings from Spain. I actually think that joining the PGA will be a boost for Lee. He’s such a good player, but maybe he’d need a full season in the States and trying to catch his first major, he’s almost 39 years old…and u know, time runs so fast!. I read some comments saying that a good golfer needs to join the PGA to play with the good ones…Let me tell u that presently European Tour is almost as powerful as PGA, just take a look on the OWGR, 4 european guys in the top-4!
In short I think it’s gonna be a good season for Lee and for my fellow country man Sergio Garcia. He’s been performing so great last weeks, winning two tournaments in a row. So hope Sergio to win his first major!
X24hot..I don’t care if Tiger is American, what he has done for the game is priceless, he took golf to a whole new level and we should all be thankful for that, but you cannot please everyone when it comes to Tiger. Why do you think most of his friends in golf are European…Ask yourself that question. I’ll repeat what i said before..McIlroy is 22 and has 1 Major yet he is nowhere near his prime.. Get used 2 him winning a lot of Majors X24hot.
Ha! You know who tigers friends are? You must be a real insider. It’s going to be harder for rory than you think. We will see. April 2012 can’t wait.
What a load of rubbish.
Mr. Logic seemingly had some sense though. I’m a lecturer in Financial Analysis and he spoke some sense above.
shaun the only thing you have seen me post on here about european players is ;i have doubts about MCILROYS mental strength when it comes to pressure & his ability to handle tough courses and conditions.LUKE DONALD a very good golfer,but i still have doubts about him on tough courses & is yet to show me he is capable off going to the next level by winning a major.he’s No1 at the moment but theres been soneone missing for 2 years, so now he & rory have the oppotunity to prove themselves with tiger back.little do you know WESTY is probably my 2nd favourite golfer & my top european player especially on tough courses. the only problem i have with EUROPEAN GOLF is** your european & you thing you can play golf**.get your facts right meathead.
X24 hot… Tiger will probably win again next year..But it’s not the tournament’s you’re thinking of.
HAO…didn’t you see my post to X24 hot?.. I was praising the GREAT ONE! for what he has done in golf and the game as a whole… You obviously didn’t read it.
@gail. In the first place, it is not fair at all to compare him to Tiger. Tiger is a phenomenen, if McIlroy won two or three more majors in the next ten years he would be doing well.
The course for the US Open suited McIlroy perfectly with the conditions and how it suited his eye, yes. But he was eight shots better than everyone else and in the zone for the entire tournament. The Masters at Augusta has tough greens where you can’t just aim at pins and some tough up and downs but McIlroy destroyed the field there again until he had a mental breakdown. Something that happens to 21 year olds that aren’t machines like Woods. But he’ll learn for next time.
The point is that the course was easier than usual but he still annihalated it, 63 greens out of 72. Rory won’t win many US Opens but the course was not too dissimilar to a US PGA Championship anyway.
As for the comment about ‘fancying’ playing Tiger, I’m pretty sure that the interviewer asked him would you like to play Tiger and he said ‘he wouldn’t mind the opportunity’. Who wouldn’t have wanted to play him the week after he finished bottom of the field at Firestone? Rory loves Tiger, he speaks of admiration of him all the time as a hero when he grew up. He could say 200 nice things about Woods and one tabloid changes him into an enemy.
Then for the Townsend comment – not sure you know the whole background to that. Townsend was tweeting saying that his short game was equivalent to that of an under 10s tournament. Not only that but he went on a rant against his caddy. What a disrespectful comment and Rory had to stick up for his caddy. He probably regrets the wording of what he said now but he’s a young guy, people make mistakes.
I’d love to see Rory in the last group with Woods, what great viewing it would be.
I would admit that I would fear McIlroy would get psyched out of it first time it happens as a young guy still learning but give him the experience, he’d be rich for it. Of course, he’d be a ‘bottler’ and ‘no good’ if it did happen but the true golf fans would know that when Rory hits his prime he’ll win prolifically.
Great comments guys and girls. This coming year will be a great one. I’m glad to see all of you are waiting with baited breath as I am. Scott,gail Shaun, dave… All of you are in rare form. Not you Lucy. I can’t wait for next to get here. The golf and the comments will be great. Everyone in America have a great Thanksgiving and you Euros have a good weekend. I’ll see you next week.
Dave… Do you think Rory would improve a lot more if he had Billy Foster on his bag after he and Westwood part company. I think it could happen within the next 5 years. JP is a friend of Rory’s and a top caddie but has made quite a few mistakes under pressure.. Why did he let Rory hit Driver of the 10th tee at Augusta?
Dave- that’s the problem I have. All of these young guys are saying tiger isn’t scary or intimidating anymore but none of them have been in the position to see what it’s like when he’s playing well on a Sunday. Well badds just got a taste of it. I want them to say it when they beat him when he is playing well. Until then don’t comment on someone else’s game. The main difference between tiger and rory that I see is I don’t remember ever seeing tiger choke away a big lead at a major or ever for that matter. And I’ve never seen him hit from the cabins at Augusta.
X24hot… Y.E Yang USPGA Championship 2009…Just talking FACTS. Tiger had the lead by 3 and LOST!
As I said, Woods is a special case but he’s played badly in final rounds in recent years as well. You could say he ‘choked’ the 2009 PGA Championship, Yang played well that day but Woods was mediocre at best on the Sunday and should have won with the lead. Same in the 2009 Tour Championship and 2009 HSBC.
There’s pressure on Tiger too people seem to forget. He has to prove a point by winning again, he’s not won since autumn 2009 before everything that happened. He’s not guaranteed to just pick up the winners touch again.
@shaun – possibly so, JP doesn’t seem to interact much but Rory trusts him so I think that’s the most important thing. At the end of the day, the caddy is only there to advise Rory calls the shots in the end. Foster wouldn’t leave Westwood though.
shaun^^ whats up?
good to see you^^
still going on here, i love to read it.
you know what shaun^^ in golf. anybody can bit anybody, any givin days.am i wrote it right? shaun.i love to read dave’s post, and x24hot is pretty smart too. that’s how i learn lots of golf.
Hi hotwater.. I’m doing well.. Hope you have a good enjoyable Thanks Giving.
You’re right when you say anyone can win on any giving day, it’s happened a lot throughout the years, especially in The Open Championship.
Good to hear that you’re learning golf from master. HA HA!! It just proves that I talk a lot of sense.
I like to look at golf in different ways compared to a lot of single minded people that post comments on here.
How long have you been interested in Golf? Do you play Golf?
go Zimbabwe go
since.1975 may, i remember first i started golf.^^ yes one point i had 2 handicap.
that year i was crazy about play golf. but my back was show me that i had to slow down.golf is good for everyone, if they start. once they start, either way getting crazy or quite , still that’s heart break^^ shaun^^
Wow hotwater.. You have been playing golf along time at a good standard..Well before i was born.. Good on you. I started playing at age 8, manage to down to a 3 handicap when i was 16 or 17, not playing as much in recent years.. occupied with to many things nowadays.
Mmm lot of rubbish amidst the reasoned debate on this forum. Like it or not 3 majors and most WGC events are played in the US. This creates a natural advantage for US players and the need for non Americans to have to play over there to aclimatise to the conditions. What’s disappointing is the aversion of, in my opinion, too many top American players avoiding the big ‘overseas’ events. Notably the best, Nicklaus, Woods, Watson never fell into this category.
Given the above it’s automatic that the US tour is bigger but no denying that european players are enjoying a good time of it in terms of strong performances. World ranking points reflect the number of top 50 players in the field so with more europeans getting up there then the euro tour events gain more points creating more opportunity etc. Ultimately the biggest point events are the majors, WGC events plus one or two others so a player has to do well in these, ie the US, to really move up the rankings.
The last two years show 8 different major winners none of whom have won that many other events or been that consistent over the timeframe. Luke Donald has won numerous strong events combined with a list of high finishes in strong fields that’s why he’s no. 1 as opposed to the guys who’ve picked up a major.
As to some of the comparisons it’s all a matter of opinion. But if we look at the up and coming young players let’s say under 30. It will be interesting to see in 10 years time who did better Americans or non Americans in terms of major wins. Right now it’s looking 50:50ish.
Not sure who the next 4+ major winner is going to be say , let’s discard Tiger for now! Many think McIlroy but I can see the argument for both sides there. I’d put Kaymer in the possibles list, lot of wins for his age, but hard to predict the next American, don’t think we’ve seen enough yet to know which player will break through. DJ, Bradley, Simpson Fowler? and what about Schwartzel, Oosthuizen and Day not to mention the far east players.
Bet there’s be a whole list of different opinions on this one.
I really don’t care if someone says the US style of play is better or the European style is better I just want to see ggood golf. As far as tiger I hope he never wins again cause I’m tired of hearing about him. I am American and pull for Furyk cause I to have a funky swing and grip but as far as “european” players I think Donald, poulter, mcdowell and rory all have great potential. Westwood is just somebody I don’t care for. I don’t like his game, his comments, and something just irks me about the way he carries himself … In fact if I could have my choice to play a four ball of euros it would include Donald, poulter, and harrington. Partnering with poulter. People on both sides on the pond need to relax cause here soon I see a tour combining almost all of the biggest event from both tours
richard^^
good opinions, it’s too late .every sleep now. but, still you’re very smart on here.^^
@ tigerfan – You hope Lee Westwood loses to Tiger? You say the Europeans talked too much last year? Could that be anything to do with Europe having FAR BETTER players than America right now and our domination in the Ryder Cup in recent years?
He finally realised the money and fame is in America???? Ummm, do some research and you will find out that Lee Westwood is far from POOR – he is 2nd in the All-Time Career Money Winner on the European Tour which btw is better than the America Tour with far more different courses. America courses for the most part is smash, bang wallop, all power all up in the air, not much shot making bar a few American Tournaments.
Westwood has earned over 2 million Euros this season on the European Tour and just under 26 million Euros in his Career. Which in case you didnt know is far more than the Majority of the PGA Tour Pros will ever make. So before you go ahead and make a stupid comment, think first.
@ tigerfan – Just did a little research to prove your theory utter nonsense ….On top of Lee Westwoods’ near 26 million Euros during his illustrious European Tour Career … in 146 starts on the US PGA TOUR he has made 116 cuts, 2 wins, 4 seconds, 4 thirds, some of these in US Majors…and a lowly I guess in your eyes…10.6 million Us Dollars.
So 26 million Euros in Europe and 10.6 million dollars in America..You’re right, Lee Westwood “Finally” figured out the “fame and fortune” is in America! Silly child.
The 10.6 million Dollars is more than 95% of PGA Tour Pros earn if they had a 20+ year Career on TOUR.
Good Move Lee. late 30s is your peak in golf. Do it for us Europeans, teach that toothless Tiger a lesson or 2. Like you did in Wales last year in the Ryder Cup (I was there Live) when you teamed with fellow Englishman Ross Fisher and destroyed Tiger Woods and Steve Stricker 6&4.
@ gail – How on earth was Rory Mcilroy “out of line” for shutting up Jay Townsend? Who exactly is Jay Townsend? Saying a guy ranked #2 in the World Rankings has the short game of a 10 year old is doing your job commentating? No sorry, neither is running down the guy’s Caddie. Jay Townsend is a FORMER pro, who played on MANY Tours because he WASNT GOOD ENOUGH to retain his card on that particular Tour at the time. He is a golfing reject who’s speaking nowadays is far better than his golf ever was. Jay Townsend should keep his mouth shut.
Your Hero Tiger Woods has never had a problem with saying things out of line, has he? He’s never said anything deemed arrogant? Who are you kidding? TW swears all the time! So does Poulter but the difference is everyone ignores Tiger Woods as if he is a God and says Poulter is out of line. TW also slams clubs, never shouts “fore” and worst of all; SPITS. Thats one thing I’ve noticed about American golfers, the majority of them spit. Young children are going to copy them and get this horrible habit.
Jay keep hoping for forum and did one of you say 116 made cuts and 2 wins for Westwood? Wow if that’s not a recipe for success I don’t know what is. It isn’t the who can make a living tour. It the who can win your. Westwood is an above average golfer who made a resurgence at the right time. Whe tiger was dipping but even then still no major. Why can’t these guys even win their own countries major? Too busy acclimating to the us I guess. Darren Clarke? Someone was talking about anomalies earlier that is the definition!!
And yes tiger lost to yang but that’s exactly the point he lost. He didn’t give it away with 4 puts and roof pops. Super-clover choked plain and simple.
What is up with people saying Rory Mcilroy’s win wasnt impressive because the course didn’t play “like a Us Open”???
Can Rory help what the weather was like that week? The fact there was alot of rain? Nope.
And your logic about the course being easier makes no sense for the following reason people;
IT WAS THE SAME FOR EVERY SINGLE PLAYER!!!!!!
He won by 8 shots setting 12 US Open records, can you give the guy some credit for a change. The guy you say is arrogant always praises Tiger Woods. Tiger was Rory’s hero growing up in Northern Ireland. He has always said this.
Love him or hate him, he is the real deal, Rickie Fowler America’s great hope is nothing compared to Rory, get used to seeing Rory cause he’s here for a long long time to come and will win a minimum of 6 majors.
@ x24 hot – I was making a point to “tigerfan” who said Lee Westwood finally realsied the money is only in America when he’s earned over 26 million Euros in Europe alone. The guy does alot of travel and is probably suffering from jeg lag half the time.
Yes 2 wins BUT 10.6 million dollars and isnt even a member of your US TOUR.
On the US TOUR you can have average players now like Steve Marino – who literally has never won a single tournament in 140 or so starts, yet he has made a staggering 8.9 million dollars.
And players in the past like Brett Quigley whos been a Pro since 1991 played over 400 tournaments on TOUR and won exactly ZERO TIMES.
@ x24hot – Yang never beat Tiger – the match I was watching, 25 year old world number 24 or so that plays solely on the One Asia Tour by the name of Kyung-Tae Kim, single handedly BEAT TIGER!!! Funny how it goes – Woods loses 3 games in a row, then he scrapes by 1 then wins against a struggling Aaron baddeley to get the winning points and everyone in America forgets how bad Tiger played overall.
And no Europeans on that list on either tour?
Brett Quigley is the highest earner on the US TOUR with zero wins by the way with 11 million dollars. Well I guess he deserves it. The American tour has precisely too much money for medicore players.
@ x24hot – what list are you talking about?
The I make a living playing golf but I dont win. And Sean how can you say he beat him single handed in a team match. That’s ridiculous
@ x24hot just saying Kyung Tae Kim was making more putts than Yang was, is all.
About the money debate without winning – i agree with you that alot of European players make a nice living without winning too but if you look at people who’ve made 10 million Euros or more .. theyve all won tournaments and in most cases more than 1 tournament with many top 10s to accumulate that cash. In recent seasons on the US Tour, players have made over 1 million dollars in 1 season with no wins and like 2 top 10 finishes or sometimes 0 top 10s with perhaps 10 top 25 finishes.
The money in America is too “top heavy”. You should get more for winning and less for the runner up and top 10 spot. What I mean is you can finish 2nd in the US and still earn 800k in 1 event. Thats more than most European Tour events give you for winning.
What is your h/cap today Sean???
At 3 now, dont get to play often any more =[
Yeah and tiger hit more greens and fairways than dj. Kim hit puts because hisPARTNER put him on the green with a chance. The whole money thing I agree with you.
@ Aaron Smith – The PGA TOUR is greater than any other tour you say? Who is World Number 1? Luke Donald. Is he American? No. Is he a full time PGA Tour member? No. Did he win 2 times on the European Tour in 2011? Hell yes. Who is World Number 2? Rory Mcilroy. Is he a PGA Member? No. IS he YOUR US Open Champ? Yes. Who’s World Number 3? Lee Westwood. Is he a PGA Member? No. Who’s World Number 4? Martin Kaymer. What Tour does he play full time on? European Tour. Who won the last Ryder Cup? Europe. Who hold the top 4 spots in the World? Europe. None of these 4 are full time PGA Tour members, 3 aren’t members at all. So your theory saying the US Tour is the best in the world doesnt have much backing up.
Internationals and Europeans end up joining the US Tour alot so that makes it THE BEST TOUR? Nope. The reason they join is simply to take your American Dollars. The PGA Tour is the Richest Tour but that doesn’t make it the best.
Have you even watched a European Tour event? And if yes, more than once? You watch a few European Tour events and you will see there’s more better “middle order” players so to speak than the American tour has. You will see the European courses like the ones in Scotland, Ireland and Wales are alot TOUGHER than PGA Tour courses. You have more wind in the UK for a start, more rain, more Trees. Your courses are all about who hits the ball the highest and the furthest with not much shot-making going on. I bet you havent watched a regular European Tour event and yet you’re judging it.
Once again, great posts! Ricki Fowler is America’s great hope? Rory will win a minimum of 6 majors? I’ve noticed how American golfers always spit? Does anyone have a clue here? Fowler has some charisma, unlike his counterpart across the pond, and he gets a lot of ink because he’s somewhat flamboyant. Not sure anyone considers him nearly the player that some of the other young Americans are, like Whatney, Johnson, etc… Rory better get a short game and learn to handle pressure before he gets to 6 majors, as whether it’s the meltdown at Augusta or even leaving it in the bunker on #18 at the Ryder Cup, he doesn’t show that he can overcome the heat. Concerning spitting, see Sergio Garcia and if you don’t remember, I’ll give you a hint. Look in the cup….
Actually Sean rory and lee are 2012 us PGA members. So maybe they see something you don’t.
@ x24hot – Lee Westwood has 35 professional wins in a stellar career earning 26 million euros in 18 years as a professional. It’s taken him 18 years to join your PGA Tour. And it is solely for your money. It’s like Robert Karlsson who’s in his 40s now with double digit wins on the European Tour (most for a Swede past Jesper Parnevik). I guess since Westwood is 38 now he should be at his peak in golf he wants to take his game to America to make alot more cash. Watch I guarantee you that both Rory Mcilroy and Lee Westwood will play the minimum amount required to qualify for earning their card for the 2013 season. Not sure what it is over there think you need to play 15 events in Europe. Probably similar there. They will continue to play in Europe too.
Tiger Woods, your great Hero must not be very liked on the US PGA Tour. I can see why. The guy is as arrogant as anything.
Why is it Tiger Wood’s friends are European? I believe Darren Clarke is a very close friend of Tiger’s as is Thomas Bjorn. Why is Tiger not liked by his fellow peers?
Just cause the PGA Tour has the most money doesn’t make it the best tour in the world. See world rankings. Plus, take a look at your number 1 sport, American Football, probably your richest sport. You pay players hundreds of thousands of dollars a week, millions a year on Contract. Do you honestly believe every player that earns say 200 thousand Dollars a week is the best American Football player?
Sean…What are you talking about? In one breath, to Tigerfan, you talk about how Westwood makes all this money in Europe so he doesn’t need to play in the USA. Then, you talk about him coming to America because of the cash. Then, you start saying that Tiger’s only friend is Darren Clarke. Next, it’s a rant about what American football players make. What’s next? You going to start telling us how rugby is the best sport in the world? Get a grip, dude. You’re all over the place….
The moral of the story is the US Tour has too much money on it. You can be an average player now like Steve Marino and have 9 million in the bank or 400 starts Brett Quigley NO WINS and 11 million dollars. Or Stewart Cink with over 30 million and ONLY 6 wins. Only reason Euros join US is for the money it doesnt mean its the best Tour in the world. And besides I will see better golf by the euros on the pga tour than the majority of american players!
Luke Donald isnt full time on the pga tour. he won 2 times in europe in 2011. hes 50/50. lee westwood has been 100% euro for 18 years. mclroy 100% euro til next year where like Luke he will be 50/50 on tours same for westwood.
european courses are harder and GAIL – THE US OPEN FOR THE SAME FOR ALL PLAYERS. YOU CANT SAY MCILROY ONLY WON CAUSE IT WAS SOFT CONDITIONS. RORY CANT HELP THE CONDITIONS. ALL OTHER PLAYERS HAD THE SAME CHANCE TO WIN AND THEY COULDNT DO IT.
Watch a euro event before calling european tour weak. we hold top 4 spots and the ryder cup! you will see there are better players in europe.
ALSO THE PGA TOUR HAS MORE WORLD RANKING POINTS. THIS IS MOST IMPORTANT. LOOK YOU HAD BRETT WETTERICH AND VAUGHN TAYLOR REPRESENT THE US TEAM IN THE RYDER CUP LMFAO!!
Good night all!
@ gail – tiger fan said “finally lee sees the fame and fortune is on the pga tour” or something along these lines. i only mentioned lee westwoods earnings on the european tour because if your a great player like he is, and ernie els is (#1 in money list all time in europe) and colin montgomery was (over 24 million euros you can still make an excellent living. These guys are WINNERS. Brett Quigley has played 400 tournaments and never won, yet you see his career earnings read 11 million dollars? All I was saying to tigerfan is lee westwood didnt join the us pga tour because he’s desperate for money.
The only point I was making gail is you have to win in europe to make lots of money. you can play for 20 years like brett quigley has and yet earn 11 million dollars. steve marino has 9 million dollars and hasnt won an event either.
@ gail – westwood has earned 26 million euros in europe and 10.6 million dollars in america. you look at players like Mike Weir, David Toms, Justin Leonard.. sure these guys have won 1 major each .. but they have won 9 pga tour events in Weirs case, 12 in Leonards and like 14 in Toms. Yet all 3 of these men have made around 30 million dollars in their career. Lee Westwood has 4 times Weirs wins with 35 worldwide yet has made virtually the same money. westwood has 3 times leonards wins and over 2x tom’s wins and has same money. this is wrong. the us tour is too “top heavy” with the money. if you get 1 million for a win on the pga tour, you should not get 800 thousand like most weeks, it should be like 500 thousand, around half…like it is on the european tour. you are rewarded far more for wins.
@ gail – I am not trying to get people hating me on here. i am a huge fan of watching the us pga tour every week. i enjoy betting on it too. i am also a fan of the european tour however and feel as though its unfair to call the us tour the best in the world. it has more money this doesnt mean the actual players are better.
people also forget the pga tour gives more world ranking points so in alot of cases people ranked say 30th in the world rankings whos a PGA TOUR player is probably a worse player than a guy ranked 50th who played solely on the European Tour simply because of the difference in world ranking points.
Also to critisize Simon Dyson calling him a poor player is wrong. He won 2 tournaments on the European tour in 2011, 1 of these the Irish Open which is big over here.
@Gail…Your Obviously out of the kitchen.. Why not put your feet up and relax.
Sean…Briny Baird is another US golfer that has won a lot of money without a win.. Daylight robbery in my opinion. It doesn’t seem a US golfer needs to work that hard to get rich.. most of them have no ambition apart from Woods or Mickelson.
Gail… Where is the next star to come out of the US?.. he’ll probably be on the Nationwide Tour in his Mid 30s.
Simon Dyson has double figures wins, 6 on the european tour and 4 on the asian tour (he played full time in Asia in 2000 and won the Asian money list) he’s had top 10s in 2 majors, most players dont have any. so he is far from a poor player Gail. he is a good solid player.
@ Shaun – Yes I agree with you. Stewart Cink is not a fighter at all, the same with Matt Kuchar now. You watch them play, although very good players, they are always smiling and dont seem to have the fight or grit needed to go ahead and win multiple times yet these 2 men have made so much money during their career.
yes your right about briny baird. i forgot about him i think its him thats made the most without a win actually and not Brett Quigley.
if you see the people on the european tour who’ve earned what briny baird, brett quigley, skip kendall have earned .. all the euros are Multiple Winners to get this amount.
@ Shaun – I also agree with you about the Nationwide Tour. If you check out the players who earned their cards by finishing Top 25 in the 2011 Nationwide Tour money list, the majority of them are in their 30s, many of the names I dont recognize. Some of them are even in their 40s. Probably the oldest group of players to ever come onto the PGA Tour via the Nationwide in the same year.
Rickie Fowler is their best hope, and he is 1/5 of Rory Mcilroy’s game right now.
The other young player who is the real deal i believe besides Mcilroy of course who’s already proven himself despite all the American haters is Jason Day. This kid is a multiple major champion in the making. He has the arrogance you need to go ahead and win multiple times. something matt kuchar doesnt have. hes too much of a nice guy you have to be a jerk like tiger woods to win alot these days.
good night all take care!
Rory McIlroy’s swing is perfection. Can anyone else think of a better swing in the game? I think NOT!
Skip Kendall!! That made me LOL!!
Rickie Fowler doesn’t even come close to matching Rory McIlroy… He’s not in the same league.
Gail… Bradley won a Major and didn’t even make your Presidents Cup team.. What a FAILURE!
Gail..Soon Tiger and Phil will be finished. Who’s going to be the new American hero.. Brett Wetterich?
Get back to me on those comments Gail.. Goodnight!
Its nice to hear that Lee Westwood will be joining the PGA Tour in 2012. It was only about 55 weeks ago that he kicked Tiger Woods in the rear “Out of 1st place in the OWGR rankings”. It was like playing a game of “Snakes and Ladders” with Woods slipping out of the Top 50 positions.
I thing the present of Westwood will add a little spice to the Tournaments next year. Its only natural for the European Golfers to want to place on the European Tour, just like the U.S.A. born golfers playing the the PGA Tour.
Outside of the Chevron Tournament next week, things are going to be quite until Santa Claus comes. The only players that should be playing next week are the Golfers who Won Tournaments during the year.
Sean great career for lee no majors. Maybe playing in us will help him win THE BRITTISH OPEN!! Ha!!! Good luck!!
Nedbank Golf Challenge N/A 4:00 PM, Thu 01 Dec 2011
Winner
Donald Luke 4.50
Westwood Lee 4.50
Kaymer Martin 6.00
Schwartzel Charl 7.00
Bjorn Thomas 11.00
Mcdowell Graeme 13.00
Karlsson Robert 13.00
Dyson Simon 15.00
Hansen Anders 17.00
Kim Kyung-Tae 21.00
Dufner Jason 23.00
Clarke Darren 29.00
x24 hot save up your money.
Shaun…not sure what you’ve been taking, but please don’t get in your car and drive after taking it. No reason to put innocent lives at risk….
Arrogant Americans! JESUS!
@sean smith: “people also forget the pga tour gives more world ranking points so in alot of cases people ranked say 30th in the world rankings whos a PGA TOUR player is probably a worse player than a guy ranked 50th who played solely on the European Tour simply because of the difference in world ranking points.” Your statement is factually incorrect. Rankings all this year have been much higher across the board event v event in Europe.
Nice one Gail.. GREAT responce.
November 24th, 2011 7:56 pm
@Gail…Your Obviously out of the kitchen.. Why not put your feet up and relax.
Sean…Briny Baird is another US golfer that has won a lot of money without a win.. Daylight robbery in my opinion. It doesn’t seem a US golfer needs to work that hard to get rich.. most of them have no ambition apart from Woods or Mickelson.
Gail… Where is the next star to come out of the US?.. he’ll probably be on the Nationwide Tour in his Mid 30s
***JASON KOKRAK***.
THE NEXT Mcilroy.^
He said it- jesus can’t help you here. And Shaun what am I saving for?
The Tiger fans are still upset about Lee and Luke trashing Tiger and Stricker 6&5 at the Ryder Cup last year
Seriously who even remembers what happened in what Ryder cup? And then once you figure that out who cares? Golf is an individual sport that we sometimes play in teams when absolutely nothing is on the line. I think we should just concede all future Ryder cups to the euros and see if anyone even notices.
Tournaments only matter when Americans win them
or when bradley plays.
X24 Hot why~ because american arrogance is too deep!? I just realized that dude!
No because it just doesn’t matter. You win you can have your little false security blanket. You can win every other year in a meaningless team event. Did you choose where you were born? I didn’t either so this trumped up match for media generated patriotism is really just a waste of time. So you get that win. Enjoy it. As far as I can see right now there are going to be 2 big names remembered in golf jack and tiger. I’ll take those 2 records over every Ryder cup in time.
Oh yeah did I mention that those 2 “anomalies” are Americans. Funny that those “anomalies” never occur in Europe. Isn’t that weird?
X24.. You don’t like the Ryder Cup only because the USA has taken so many beatings over the last 15 years or so… You always talk about record Major wins for Jack and Tiger in particular. The only reason you do that is because they are AMERICAN!.. So don’t come out with this “didn’t choose where were you born” and “patriotic” nonsense. You are deluded.
I love both the Ryder Cup and the Majors.
X24hot.. A lot of people will remember SEVE!!.. What a LEGEND!!
The Ryder Cup is a lot more important to golf then what X24 hot seems to think it is.
I guess certain people just don’t “get” it. I also didn’t get it when I was 15 or so….then one day it just clicked. I have attended the Friday of 3 Ryder Cups (2006, 2008 and 2010), and there is nothing quite like being around that first tee box on the Friday morning as the first group prepares to tee off. You can see the nerves in the players eyes.
I hope to 1 day attend The Masters so I can claim to have attended all 4 majors (I’ve been to the other 3) and the Ryder Cup.
Darren Clarke? Someone was talking about anomalies earlier that is the definition!!
Eh, Darren Clarke has won two WGC, including a defeat of Tiger Woods in his pomp in 2000. How you can say that he doesn’t deserve a major over the course of his career is absurd to be honest.
lol at X24 hot denouncing the meaning of the Ryder Cup. Many see it as the biggest event in golf actually, the pinnacle. I know many people that watch golf only for the Ryder Cup.
‘Fowler has some charisma, unlike his counterpart across the pond’
Did McIlroy rape your family or something? Why do you hate him so much?!
Who said that Fowler has charisma? I’ve seen more personality in a dead cat
Gail did.
Fowler wears fancy clothes and seems like a cool guy but when he talks he’s actually quite dull.
Rory seems like an interesting guy.
It’s about time rory and Lee come to the states and show them how true gentlemen are supposed to act. The PGA tour is over run with silver spoon spoiled assholes who think they are gods. watch and see how much yankee dough the boys take home…ha ha
Thrilled to see Lee joining the US Tour. Should make 2012 an exciting season. Hope Rory commits as well.
Why do you guys fall for this junk, do you not wonder why it is so easy to refute?
Eric… Rory annouced he was joining months before Westwood did.. It will be 100 times better to watch the PGA Tour next season.. I’m looking foward to it.
If the junk wasn’t taken to the bin then the internet would be a mess.
Yeah everybody loves the Ryder cup all three of you. You guys love it because you hate Americans and that’s just a brainwashing from your parents. Patriotism is a made up thing. Admit it. The Ryder cup is the same thing who cares who wins and I think Steve is dead.
Or seve I can never remember his name or what he won
Seve has 91 pro wins including 3 Open Championships and 2 Masters titles. Only Tiger and Faldo have won more majors than him in the last 30 years
X24.. That’s DOWNRIGHT DISREPECT!!!…WOW!!!… No wonder most of the world hate you guys, only got yourself’s to blame for that.
Isn’t he known for hitting it out of a parking lot? You know what I say about that… Nice tee shot!!
Gail, your comments/logic/arguments are cyclical, inane, and pedantic. You choose to look at the statistics that support your claim, and in your narrow view of the facts, you omit blatant historical developments that directly contradict your claims. When you pick apart others’ comments, you fail to address half of their points, and you slyly deride them while attempting to seem neutral.
I would add more to disprove your arguments, but your obtuse animosity towards respecting other peoples’ thoughts would render my comments futile.
I have never been more ashamed to call myself an American than when I read your comments about European golf.
Why am I so sweaty?
X24hot… You’ve went down to the bottom of the heap in my estimation with the Seve comments.Your even worst than Gail.. That takes some doing.
I have the same problem, lefty!
5 majors > 4 majors
And Seve won all his majors before turning 32. He then became crippled by injuries. Mickelson had to wait until he was 34 before he won a major, the overrated smiling idiot.
hot/dot, your comments are out of line spalding.
Dave, read LJ on your way to “the bin”.
X24 hot.. You DISGUST me! You should be banned from posting comments on here.
THREE OBSERVATIONS about “GOLF”. ONE: tiger did show some form in melbourne, but until he performs (wins?) in a 4 day event, the jury is out on whether he is “back”. this upcoming chevron world challenge, or whatever it is called, cannot be counted. TWO: the pga tour is the top tour BUT many top europeans, south africans, australians etc etc don’t fancy spending their lives in the good old usa, just as most americans don’t play much outside home. THREE: unfortunately, some people are not aware that golf is a world game nowadays, just look at recent major winners such as YANG, SCHWARTZL, OOSTHUIZEN, CLARKE, MCILROY, HARRINGTON, MACDOWELL, CABRERA, KAYMER. the usa will continue to be strong but challenges are coming from sweden, japan and korea especially. maybe the aussies can even win another soon.
octopus **WOW** YOU SHOULD HAVE BEEN A BRAIN SURGEON.
Golf is a “world game” now??? Ya don’t say.
hao,i am a neurosurgeon. shock and awe, i do say.
If you play the majors and WGC you already have 7 PGA tournamentsd played. Another 4 fedex play offs and they only have to play 4 more to keep their card. Money and easy courses make them go there. It is good for european golf to play at the PGA tour so Americans learn what real golf is all about nowadays. We see no americans having the guts to play on the european tour, because they cannot handle the travelling and make stupid remarks like Bubba did in Paris.Only Dustin Johnson would like to travel and play more in Europe which is good news.
For the USA it is good that they have the presidents cup, so they can win at least some silly exhibition as in the real thing the Ryder cup they have almost forgotten what it is to win and for our top european golfers it is almost less exciting to meet these weak US teams.(lol)
This year we won the money list and POY, with more european top golfers coming in we win in 2012 also the fedex cup and bring the dollars to Europe. Ndext year another easy ryder cup win in the USA to show the strenght of european golf.And Tiger will be a mediocre player that now and then wins, his supremacy has finished.
Shaun you spew out generalizations about a country being arrogant. Isn’t that type of judgement arrogant. Aren’t you better than all of us “yanks”. And as for what I said about seve, was any of it wrong? He is dead and he was known for recovery shots, which means he put himself in a lot of bad spots with bad golf shots. Why is it disrespectful to say what you mean? I think what it comes down to is you just don’t like my opinion and that’s fine but, I don’t speak for America I speak for me. And I say if you want to talk about golf dominance over the last 40-50 years I will take tiger and jacks 32 majors and counting over anyone else’s record, and I’ll give you every Ryder cup in the future because it just doesn’t matter who wins that phony event. I also guarantee you that if a euro duo had that many majors you wouldn’t be saying that it’s old news you would be screaming about respecting the game and euros pushed Americans to get better. You are judgmental and contradictory not to mention totally biased. The fact is American golf has made European golf better you’re welcome!!
Brits you should read your comments. There is a trend right across them of HAVING to prove the Euro players are better than the US players. Apart from X24′s sad comments about Seve he is right that the Ryder Cup is NOT as important in the US as it is in Europe. Your continued protesting smarts of inferiority complex.
It does not matter who wins the Ryder Cup, the fact is the USPGA Tour is the big money tour and it has tremendous depth. If a golfer has not succeeded there, he can’t claim to have made it in golf.
I could go out on a limb here and say that the top 30 on the Nationwide Tour would do better than survive on the Euro Tour.
Good on you Westy – go for it.
X24… It was the way you said those comments about Seve..Sounded like a total lack of DISRESPECT too me. He was a LEDEND of the game. I don’ Care about any other comments you make from now on cause that was the lowest of the low.
Lee Westwood, until he wins a major, anytime he is Number 1, it is only on paper. For now, he and Luke Donald have been and are paper Number 1′s. Shaun, if there is a lack of disrespect, then there is literally no disrespect.
Sorry made a mistake.. X24 hot has no RESPECT! to a LEGEND!.. We all miss you in Europe Seve. RIP!
Shaun you are irrational. If you think you can hear the context in which I type you are silly as well. And if you think calling a dead person dead is disrespectful then you are a little sensitive. And if you think that same dead guy can hear you or read these posts then you are just plain crazy. The fact is rory came to the us for money and better playing conditions, lee followed him like a sheep. Lee tried to force a change in the PGA tour policy with his schedule last year when he was #1 and it didn’t work. Personally I think it’s great for everyone because we will see the best against the best. No excuses!
In 1996 he won his first professional tournament, the Volvo Scandinavian Masters, closely followed by the Sumitomo VISA Taiheiyo Masters in Japan. His success continued in 1997 defending his Japanese title and winning the Malaysian Open, the Volvo Masters in Spain, and the Holden Australian Open, beating Greg Norman in a playoff. He also partnered with Nick Faldo in the Ryder Cup that year.
Westwood has won 21 events on the European Tour and has also won tournaments in North America, Africa, Asia and Australia. His most successful year to date has been 2000 when he won seven tournaments worldwide and was ranked first on the European Order of Merit, ending Colin Montgomerie’s long run of European Tour dominance
X24hot.. You quoted “or seve I can never remember his name or what he won.” I find the to really disrespectful to a man who is a LEGEND! in golf that died of a terrible disease only a few months ago. You are trying to cover it up.. But it’s not working.
I was just being honest. Imean he hasn’t played competitively for a while so I can’t say I remember any wins except a green jacket. And the thing about his name was a joke because my phone automatically put in the name Steve for seve. So simmer down kid.
‘Yeah everybody loves the Ryder cup all three of you. You guys love it because you hate Americans and that’s just a brainwashing from your parents. Patriotism is a made up thing. Admit it. The Ryder cup is the same thing who cares who wins and I think Steve is dead.’
If you lot don’t care, how do you explain Brookline then? The incessant USA, USA, USA and bad sportmanship?
Glad to see everyone is still at it. First, I don’t go for X24′s comments, as we should leave our disagreements outside of unfortunate and sad situations like the one that befell Seve. Secons, I’m surprised that LJ is an American, as his verbiage seems like that of a Brit. I love the second paragraph, where he says he would “add more to disprove your arguments,” when his first paragraph didn’t address one specific comment, prove or disprove a thing, or mean anything except that he sits at his computer with a Thesaurus. Of 300+ comments, we have a new winner with the longest post that said absolutely nothing of value. Please, going forward let’s stay on topic and be respectful of the deceased…
X24… If you didn’t know Seve is a 5 time Major Champion.. He has 3 Open Championships and 2 Masters titles.. He also has 50 European Tour wins and 91 worldwide, all before the age of 35.. Not bad don’t you think? Do more research of history before you slag off a DECEASED LEGEND of the game. It was a JOKE!.. You are a JOKE!
Why is it disrespectful to call dead people dead Gail? And mother your children please leave us alone.
Well said Seff….I too consider the Nationwide Tour to be at least the equivalent of the Euro Tour, and the buck stops in the USA. Until players other than those from the USA prove themselves to be historically great, they can’t be taken seriously. Guys like Monty, who was the best player in Europe for years and years but couldn’t win in the US is a perfect example. Paul Casey is another. Good things that guys like Luke Donald went to school in the US to prepare them for professional golf…
Gail.. You are absurd!… Name me a current Nationwide Tour pro who has won a Major? Who is the best World Ranked player on the Nationwide Tour? Deluded as usual.. I’m never shocked with what you say on this now.. It’s a daily occurance.
C’mon Shaun…why would a Nationwide Tour player be on that tour if they won a major, as those wins bring with them 10 year exemptions? Please, I can’t believe that you need to be educated on almost every post. The most recent major winner, Keegan Bradley, played full time on the Nationwide Tour last year. The point is depth of the Nationwide Tour, which was the point that Seff was making…
Okay for hypothetical sake, let’s have a Ryder Cup type match of European Tour against Nationwide Tour.
Donald vs Killeen
McIlroy vs Potter. Jr.
Westwood vs Goggin
McDowell vs Kokrak
Garcia vs Blixt
Schwartzel vs Duke
Kaymer vs Brown
…and so on.
It’s quite hilarious.
This doesn’t surprise me. I mean if guys like Luke Donald can play over here, he certainly can. Just having to commit to 15 a year when he plays the four majors, the three WGC events and he will start playing the Players now and he has played the St. Jude recently, so thats nine right there Just needs to get in six more and he is eligible. I like it, but I don’t. I’m not a fan of the swing players, but unfortunately those are the best players in the world right now. He might win once or twice, but certainly won’t do anything too special.
Of the 2010 nationwide Tour graduates, Steele, Vegas and Bradley all won on the PGA Tour, with Keegan’s a major. Refresh my memory again with Monty’s wins, I mean considering he’s the best of the Euro Tour for years….
I think if you could combine Luke Donald and McIlroy together, you’d get one solid player that could win a few majors. Rory hits it well, but his short game is average at best, and Donald is a poor driver of the ball and not long, but has a good short game. Put them together and you could win maybe 4-5 majors….
By the way, considering every post from the Euros mentions the Ryder Cup…does anyone actually realize that the USA has won almost 70% of them? Results like that reek of domination, yet you’d think it was the other way around with how proud the Euros are of the results. If I won barely 30% of anything (except the lottery), I wouldn’t brag…..
Gail.. Well why do say the Nationwide Tour is currently(means the present day) equal or better than the European Tour? The European Tour has Major Champions and The Nationwide Tour doesn’t.. just speaking FACTS!.. AGAIN!.
Gail.. You are a narrow minded, deluded person..FACT!
Gail and Eric.. Americans always need to play in their back yard to win. European and International players don’t.
If the European Tour is so weak, then why has Mickelson won once here in 20 years, Dustin Johnson has played a number of times over the past three years and is yet to win, the same goes for Bubba Watson. For example, in the French Open, Watson couldn’t even make the cut.
Johnson who I admire for having the guts to play in Europe to expand his knowledge of the game, played well in Scandanavia this year but couldn’t get within 12 shots of the winner.
The Scottish Open had Kuchar, Mickelson, Palmer and their very welcome to play in Europe, I enjoy when they do. But Palmer and Mickelson were in the 50s placing and Kuchar was the best at 13th place.
If the players from the PGA Tour were so much better than European Tour players, then surely they would win when they come over here, or at least put together a top 5 everytime they come over?
Shaun…the point is simple. I just gave you (FACT) three guys that won this year after graduating from the nationwide Tour. How many European Tour members have won PGA events? With the strength of the PGA Tour and how tough it is to win (see Colin Montgomery), you’d have to agree that guys that won on the US Tour would win multiple events each year on the Euro Tour, just based on the level of competition. Remember Todd Hamilton? He was a huge star on the Japanese circuit before he won your Open. Since then, although he has won on the PGA Tour, it’s a lot tougher. If the Nationwide graduates played in Europe full-time, they’d be huge stars….
gail, donald is a somewhat short hitter but he cannot be considered a “poor driver”. i think you are off the mark there. and there is limited depth on the nationwide tour if gavin coles can get his card (again)!!!!!!!!!!!
Dave…great question! I think the Americans go over to play on the Euro Tour strictly for the appearance fee, which the Euros are willing to give to the world’s top players. I think Tiger is getting $3MM to play in one of the sand pits over there versus playing at Torrey Pines in San Diego. I think Bubba got paid a boatload to show up in France as well, because the Euros needed a big name to attract the crowds. Once you get paid 4-5 times the first place check just to show up, I think a lot of the motivation is gone. I totally agree that the Euro Tour should STOP paying the Americans millions just to show up, as I think it puts that tour in an even worse light, showing it almost to be begging to get the best players in the world. I agree that it sets a bad precedent and should be suspended going forward, as I’m sure there are a few Americans who will bring their families over and play 1 or 2 events during their careers, regardless of the bribe….
Gail… Europeans and European Tour members have won 8 PGA tour events with 3 Majors, could be better but not to bad playing away from home. I can smell the verbal diarreha from here… And i’m thousands of miles away from you.. It must be seeping through my phone.
Octopus…great to hear from you as I think it’s been since April (sorry to remind you of my Rory prognostication before the 4th round) since we’ve spoken. I’m referring to him regarding his #1 OGWR as I don’t think he drives the ball well relative to that. When comparing him to someone in the middle of the pack, I’m sure most parts of his game are better, but I guess we get spoiled with how Tiger played when he was winning, as every facet was better than almost everyone. If you’re going to consider him a top player, he needs to be stronger with the long game, although right now I would consider him the top putter in the game, or very close…
Gail… I’d like to see you try and hit the ball 300yds and straight most of the time on a consistant basis if Luke Donald is a “so called” short and wayward Driver. You have probably never played golf in your life.. If you do play I gureentee that you haven’t hit a 300 yard drive straight.
apart from **tiger mahan** i don’t want to put my money on any other u/s player to win a major next year.i would consider westy kaymer mcilroy garcia donald schwartzel choi.i believe golf to be at its lowest level now,for the last 3/5 years. horses for courses with predictions above.cheers
Shaun… I’m not a professional and I’m not ranked at the top of the OGWR, so what I can or can’t do doesn’t matter. Previous posts made me remember Seve, as at one tournament he had a group of pros at the practice bunker, and he was showing them how to flip the ball out of the trap with a lot of spin when the pin was close to the edge, but he was doing it with a 3-IRON! One thing about the Spaniards, whether it be Seve, Garcia, or even Jimenez. You’d never see them on Twitter blasting commentators, counting their followers, or conversing about their cars or whether they should wear pink slacks the next day. They’re men and act like it, with great golf games and even more charisma. Too bad the Euro tour didn’t have more types like that near the top, as they wouldn’t have to pay Americans appearance money to get a decent crowd….
Do you play golf Gail?
Shaun…how could I possible know this much about the game and not play? I’m actually an above average player, with a collegiate golf history. However, despite what you think, I’m not delusional enough to think I could play professionally, as I realize just how good those players are, and that hitting thousands of golf balls wouldn’t make much of a difference. Why do you ask?
Player Pt.s
Avg. Tot.
Pts. # of
Evts. Pts.
Lost
2009/10 Pts.
Gained
2011
1 Luke Donald, Eng 10.37 549.71 53 -261.46 500.61
2 Rory McIlroy, Nir 7.59 371.83 49 -251.77 315.83
3 Lee Westwood, Eng 7.50 322.52 43 -328.74 226.31
4 Martin Kaymer, Deu 7.02 351.23 50 -279.40 274.83
5 Steve Stricker, USA 5.80 237.75 41 -232.60 207.56
6 Dustin Johnson, USA 5.79 295.36 51 -181.82 251.10
7 Adam Scott, Aus 5.61 269.23 48 -140.20 223.45
8 Jason Day, Aus 5.50 253.17 46 -110.41 236.04
9 Webb Simpson, USA 5.22 281.76 54 -57.30 293.00
10 Matt Kuchar, USA 5.06 267.97 53 -198.27 219.17
11 Nick Watney, USA 5.05 257.43 51 -158.83 250.57
12 Phil Mickelson, USA 4.98 234.25 47 -256.61 202.69
13 Charl Schwartzel, Zaf 4.74 256.09 54 -173.51 247.75
14 Graeme McDowell, Nir 4.62 249.33 54 -222.67 139.14
15 K.J. Choi, Kor 4.57 246.81 54 -126.37 233.60
16 Justin Rose, Eng 4.24 224.84 53 -141.61 185.50
17 Sergio Garcia, Esp 4.08 187.79 46 -85.99 185.86
18 Bubba Watson, USA 3.97 190.73 48 -137.80 171.29
19 Hunter Mahan, USA 3.88 209.51 54 -173.64 168.87
20 David Toms, USA 3.77 188.56 50 -91.06 187.78
21 Paul Casey, Eng 3.72 182.33 49 -195.63 112.64
22 Bill Haas, USA 3.63 196.07 54 -103.12 175.70
23 Bo Van Pelt, USA 3.54 191.04 54 -117.89 151.16
24 Kim Kyung-Tae, Kor 3.53 190.65 54 -119.87 129.09
25 Ian Poulter, Eng 3.51 168.29 48 -207.43 102.92
26 Bae Sang-moon, Kor 3.41 146.49 43 -37.35 138.19
27 Keegan Bradley, USA 3.39 183.00 54 -25.27 186.44
28 Robert Karlsson, Swe 3.38 172.23 51 -127.90 113.30
29 Rickie Fowler, USA 3.34 180.13 54 -106.43 148.13
30 Brandt Snedeker, USA 3.33 180.07 54 -87.65 182.01
31 Anders Hansen, Dnk 3.29 167.84 51 -96.65 158.25
32 Simon Dyson, Eng 3.29 177.65 54 -96.44 155.95
33 Thomas Bjorn, Dnk 3.28 170.80 52 -61.95 168.33
34 Fredrik Jacobson, Swe 3.26 166.37 51 -59.82 163.94
35 Jason Dufner, USA 3.23 158.33 49 -84.55 159.04
36 Darren Clarke, Nir 3.16 151.85 48 -68.56 142.33
37 Louis Oosthuizen, Zaf 3.15 170.03 54 -139.68 112.12
38 Geoff Ogilvy, Aus 3.14 153.72 49 -135.16 108.21
39 Francesco Molinari, Ita 3.11 165.01 53 -166.55 89.75
40 Miguel A Jimenez, Esp 3.02 163.00 54 -152.36 119.30
41 Jim Furyk, U
Well please give us Europeans credit where credit is due Gail.. We both know this hame is very difficult. Pros make it look so easy.
Cripes do you guys read the words then replace them with what suits you.
I said the top 30 on the NW tour would “do better than survive” on the Euro tour.
That is a long way from winning a major, or even an event on the Euro tour. It is simply a matter of the depth of the NW tour.
geeeez – back to the inferiority complex
Shaun…you and I have had enough conversations to both know where I’m coming from. OBVIOUSLY, the Europeans are great players, as our discussions are all relative. Once again, just to be clear, I wish the elite pros would avoid talking about other players, namely Tiger, even though he’s a terrible guy. I think McIlroy made a terrible mistake with Townsend, as although Townsend’s comments were poor, he gets PAID to stir up those type of responses, and Rory fell right into the trap. It’s as though he gets zero coaching from his agent, which is maybe why he left Chandler. It’s only going to get worse if he’s successful, as everyone will want to take a shot at him. I think Chubby spoke too often about his lack of business experience, about how he flew by the seat of his pants, etc…, as it eventually has cost him all of his top clients. Rory and his cronies should shut up and play, let their clubs do the talking, and everyone will love them….including us Americans….
where is all the u/s strength & depth,johnson watney have blown majors,stricker hasn’t got the ticker to win one,simpson & watson got beat by kids in melbourne.mickelson playing at about 30% kutcher toms furyk haas fowler snedeker {nothing to set world on fire.} bradely could be one but too early to tell.BVP KEPT HIM FOR YOU GAIL,some off these guys will win dart comps but come to majors & afew other difficult courses you can put your money on not mine. its tiger & mahan or go elswhere. cheers.
Anyone can clearly see that there is a golfing renaissance in Europe. They have alot of young golfers looking to make their mark over the next decade with Rory, Luke, Kaymer, Casey, etc. These players are bolstering the competition level of the Euro Tour.
The reason why the PGA Tour is superior is because of the $$$. If the European Tour had half the purse $ of the US tour, they could attract the best players in the world, not just the best players in Europe.
Luke Donald knows that $ is made on the US tour. The US also hosts 3 of the 4 majors, and 4 of the 5 next biggest tournamnets in the world.
If Europe hosted 7 of the top 9 events in the world, then they would see the best players from around the globe more than once a year. So, all the European tour needs to do is drum up some more attendance, sponsors, and overall interest.
The reason why Americans are the best golfers is because the American people care more about golf than anywhere else in the world. They play more golf, watch more golf, and teach more golf. This says nothing of their education level in other areas, but they sure do know their golf.
Seff.. It’s not you, it was Gail’s response to your post that made my blood boil. It was a terrible response that had no context to what you where trying to point out. She just wanted to have another pop at European golf, like what she normally does.
Who the hell is Townend, Gail.. A poney commentator nobody has hardly heard off.
It’s Townsend Shaun, Jay Townsend, a former tour player. You don’t have to be the best player to know the most about the game, as Butch Harmon, Hank Haney, David Leadbetter, etc… are the best teachers in the world but not the best players. Jay Townsend might have been too tough for “Rors” with his words, but he was basically correct. To have an “athlete” respond like McIlroy did just shows his weakness, as I can’t imagine why he would ever engage someone who has the microphone every week. Just shows (once again) that he can’t handle the heat. You think it’s a coincidence that Rory hit balls into the cabins at the Masters where members were making sandwiches, or 4-putted #12 from 20 ft? It’s what’s inside that keeps these guys under control, and he didn’t show much when he attacked a commentator doing his job. Wait until Wozniacki dumps him, and it’ll make Sergio’s similar situation seem like it never happened…
Gail..Was it him that said a 10 year old boy has a better short game than Rory? What gives him the right to say something like that when he has contributed nothing to the game… Other than absurd opinions. At least Rory had the guts to stand up for himself.
Gail… What did McIlroy do 2 months after he hit a ball into a cabin and 4 putted the 12th from 20 feet?
gail, rory certainly folded at augusta but his dominating performance at the us open should have convinced you that he is in the elite bracket. 18 under par, then 19 players between 8 and 1 under. tigeresque? give him a break.
Octopus…no one is taking that performance away from McIlroy, but I think you would agree that the conditions played right into the strength of his game. Without true US Open firmness, short games weren’t tested, and that’s Rory’s weakness. Of course he played better than everyone that week, but the course was more like the TPC at River Highlands in Connecticut that a true Major test. When his short game is truly put to the test, in situations like Tiger faced at Medinah (PGA) on #17 early in his career or at Torrey Pines when he made the putt on the 18th to tie Rocco Mediate, I really think he’ll fall short, both because of the pressure and his lack of skill in that area of his game. You really think that he thinks he’s a great putter? C’mon…no way…
I like having the European Golfers playing the PGA Tour. The last three #1 OWGR leaders are from the other side of the Atlantic. They have a lot to offer to the fan when they play wherever that may be.
rory is an average putter, although he was a better putter a couple of years back. regardless of the course conditions at congressional, it was the us open so there was the pressure to win a major. and to compare congressional with the tpc at river highlands is just ridiculous. 3 under missed the cut at river highlands. 4 over made the cut at congressional. anyway, let’s move on. i expect martin kaymer to take over as number one in 2012. your prediction?
I like Kaymer, but he’s been invisible since the PGA win, at least in majors. Believe it or not, I like what I saw with Tiger in Australia, and I think he may win one major next year. Other than that, I like KJ Choi to break through, and maybe Jason Day, although he played terribly in the Singles at the PC….I’m interested in what you think…
One other thing octopus….I’m not sure that we know who the best of the Americans are at this point. I don’t like the fundamentals of Johnson or Fowler, and I don’t think guys like Kuchar or Stricker have the game. Maybe the next best hasn’t been there yet, as someone like Patrick Cantlay has shown that he can play under pressure. Just like in women’s golf, I think the Korean players might take the golf world by storm, as they’re dedicated and can handle the heat…
kaymer has been undergoing swing changes. he struggled early in 2011 but he looks like he is on way back. tiger did look better in melbourne but i think he needs to produce over 4 rounds. he cannot dominate as before but a major or two is not going to shock me. choi is tough but his major chances might have slipped away. day surely is the next big thing from down under, his potential is unlimited. there will be a new wave of koreans coming, k-t kim and bae look best. of the usa boys, i like the non-robotic talents of watson and even fowler. ishikawa could be ready to take next step. unsure whether donald can win a major but expect rory to win another few majors. and if only dustin johnson could putt?????
Johnson doesn’t do much really well except for hit it long and dunk a basketball. Maybe Ryo is the one, as I could tell by his swing on #1 on the last day of the PC that he was ready to go, and he might be as good of a putter as Donald. At this point, tough to tell, but I’ve watched Tiger play in person at Augusta and know what a talent he is, so it wouldn’t surprise me if he dominated again, if only because you and I can’t think of anyone who could…..
Potentially I think Martin Kaymer wiil be one of the best Europeans of all time, he has the temprament and the skills to go with it. I always like to see him win.
Gail… You might be right about Patrick Cantley being America’s best hope for the future… He looks very impressive from what I have seen of him. A valid comment.. Well done Gail.
Gail.. Did you know McIlroy is working on his putting with Dave Stockton? If he putts well next year everyone better watch out.
Shaun…great news for Rory, but he’s not prepared yet for the pressure. Tiger won 3 US Juniors and 3 US Amateurs in a row, which is probably the toughest thing to ever do in golf, short of the calendar year Grand Slam. Bottom line, Rory gags, and whether Stockton or Crenshaw or Pelz helps him with his short game, he needs to get the heart necessary to win. Without that, it’s time for Tiger….
Gail..Rory will learn to win as the years go on.. You seem to forget how young he is, especially in golfing terms. He is still 10 years or so away from his prime. His head is in a better place since his US Open victory.
You guys keep talking about Rory as though he’s Tiger, with no weaknesses. Tiger had an immaculate short game, one of the best ever, and Rory doesn’t have anywhere near that. I get the fact that he’s the best you have, but you need to stop thinking that his game is foolproof. It isn’t, and it will be borne out unless he improves with some help…
Gail, I’m glad you started addressing specific things that people have said. I don’t think anyone thinks that Rory’s short game is like Tiger’s. Yet, he is working on it. He has the potential, and we have to wait and see what happens. I think it’s foolish for you to write him off and for others to put him on a pedestal at such a young age. Personally, I am a Rory fan, a huge Rory fan. I’ve been following him since he was an amateur, and I think he could be special, but I think he needs to work on his weaknesses, and this year will be a telling year, because he has so many expectations on him.
As for me not addressing your comments previously, read my post and you will see why. Notice how I responded to them this time, because it seems like you decided to read what other people wrote. I’m sorry I graduated from an elite college and have a superior vocabulary than you, but I appreciate you resigning my intelligence to the use of a thesaurus. Why don’t you keep “prognosticating” more so that we can all look back and realize what a Nostradamus you are.
Gail.. Why do always compare Rory with Tiger. It’s unfair to judge someone so young with one of the greatest of all time. It’s unlikly Rory will match Tiger’s Major record.. But he is the only one in the current era capable of getting close to Tiger. In my opinion I think McIlroy will win 7 to 10 Majors.
LJ…I always love those who have to tell you that they’re elite, as that in itself is a reason to doubt. Fortunately, there’s nothing about you I would envy, least of all your success, as you don’t have much of it if you have to tout it. Trust me, your vocabulary is far from elite, and I wonder why you would “appreciate” the fact that I resigned your intelligence to the use of a Thesaurus. Once again, you join the group of those that need to read their posts before they actually submit them, as what you’ve said is not intelligent, and it’s not anything that anyone would need to “prognosticate” to counter. Whatever “elite” college you graduated from, get a refund. You’re still the same dope you were before you enrolled….
CALM DOWN Gail.. That’s not a very nice thing to say about LJ.
Lj you say superior to not superior than. I agree with the request for a refund.
gail, don’t think you’re aware but Rory built one of the best practice areas I’ve ever seen in his back garden in Belfast this year after the US Open.
3-4 different types of green, all the different possible slopes, adjustable speed to suit the same speed as the course on the week he is playing, 3 or 4 different types of sand, a deep links bunker, bermuda rough, links rough the whole shabang.
I already see improvements in his putting, he’s always going to be a better driver of the ball than Tiger Woods and will get more chances at birdies at his best so he doesn’t have to match Woods in the putting to beat him, he just need to be somewhere good-very good at it.
Also here’s a random thought, Harrington has won more majors than Woods since 2007. Harrington has a new swing coach also and was off-form for a few years. He recently finished 3rd in Malaysia, isn’t Harrington almost as likely on recent major form to win another major as Woods? Yet despite showing around the same recently, Woods is ‘back to his best’ and Harrington is ‘past his best’.
Dave do you think he will be home on the weeks he’s playing to work on those adjustable greens? And you are all proving her point his short game is weak.
Not every week no, but preparing for most of the big ones that matter.
Let’s see next year shall we, I already see McIlroy putting nicely as Ireland lead the World Cup this weekend. He had some Tiger like up and downs this week as well.
X24… Rory McIlroy has more chance of winning a major next year than Tiger Woods does just except it.. Just face it Tiger is over the hill and nearly at the bottom. He’ll soon be 40 and crippled.
Dave… All these people that say Rory McIlroy doesn’t have a short game and want him to fail are scared of the fact he will be around for a long time winning lots tournament and Majors.. While Tiger Woods will be on the downward spiral to oblivion.
Dave I agree let’s wait until next year. Shaun he will be 40 in 12 majors. He’s averaged just under one a year on tour be afraid be very afraid!!! Thou do protest too much!! I don’t want rory to fail I want him to prove that he’s not a choker at a huge venue under tough conditions. Then I will say he’s better than Ben Curtis!!
X24 hot.. Typical response from you.. I expected it.. Bring on 2012, McIlroy will prove the doubters wrong.. Remember he is 22 and he is certainly no Ben Curtis. Where is the former Open Champion nowadays?
X24 hot.. That was the OLD Tiger with that average.. He can never be as good as he once was.. 2000 will never be repeated.. By anyone.
Yeah old 2008 tiger ha! You are scared I smell it in your posts.
The course is far from a normal US Open setup, but everyone is playing the same place, so there’s nothing to take away from Rory’s performance. No way to lose this with how he’s playing, and he looks like he’s in a different league than Y.E.Yang
June 18th, 2011 1:40 pm
They have the technology with sub-air to get the greens harder and faster, which they MUST do to make this a real US Open. The greens are way too receptive to shots out of the rough and if they firm them up, those will race over the green, making it really tough to get it up and down. If they had done that early, I think McIlroy would have a bigger lead, considering how well he drove the ball in the first two rounds, but they need to make this harder. This event should demand more precision
gail
June 18th, 2011 1:31 pm
I can’t understand why everyone keeps saying how obvious it is that Rory has learned from the Masters. He lost the lead the next week in Europe and hasn’t won since. He’s never had a problem in the beginning of events, as evidenced by the fact that he’s lead each of the last 4 majors early on. To say he’s learned a lot from Augusta, however, don’t we need to wait until Sunday night? If he gives up this lead and loses, what would anyone argue that he learned
June 17th, 2011 12:36 pm
Hey Jason…how have you been? Haven’t heard much from you since you guaranteed Rory’s Master’s win after Saturday’s lead. I guess it was a bit harder than you thought, eh? Nevertheless, one of these days you’ll be right, so keep hanging in. Wonder if the top three in the world will make the cut…I mean, they’re the best players on the planet, right?
us masters 2012…. i select casey, simpson and mickelson. anybody else care to put their reputation on the line?
woods woods woods.
Dave- how did that world cup thing go? I am seeing a disturbing pattern on Sundays when the pressure is high. Now I’m sure all of you will blame it on his partner but shouldn’t super clover be able to carry a partner? Not so many “tiger-like” up and downs on Sunday I guess.
He chipped into the hole on 12, did you see that one?
They just made too many mistakes, didn’t happen this time. Has no real bearing on next season, the Americans deserved to win.
Kuchar might win a major next year, very underrated. One of the best Americans but you’re too obsessed with Woods to notice.
Woodland hits some brilliant shots too. Well done to them, the best team won on the day.
But the two Irishmen have won the last two US Opens, it didnt happen for them but they will win many Ryder Cup matches in that pairing in the future.
So you’re telling me if the Irish boys won you would’ve said it has no real bearing on next season. I know who both kuchar and woodland are and yes they are very good. We agree there. And I love the “it didn’t happen for them” line. I’ve never seen a winner in golf that sat back and waited for the win to happen to them. Usually they go out and take the trophy, maybe they were just waiting for someone to give it to them. Well I guess they will have to keep waiting
une 17th, 2011 6:08 pm
By the way, every guy on this site seems to relish giving me a hard time, just because I’m opinionated, but isn’t that what this is about? I’m used to it, as I know get to model golf clothing but I used to work at Hooters, which is a restaurant chain in the US where the guys “hoot” at the girls. Same thing when I did some modeling at Hawaiian Tropic…everyone has something to say or just hoots and hollers at the girls. Hopefully, the golfers here will realize I’m a decent player and know something about the game, maybe more than they do…
November 27th, 2011 11:52 am
November 21st, 2011 7:27 pm
Great chance for South Africa to win this event
‘And I love the “it didn’t happen for them” line. I’ve never seen a winner in golf that sat back and waited for the win to happen to them.’
Eh, if you go for a shot and you don’t pull it off, it doesn’t happen? Who said anything about them waiting for it to happen then?
They made it happen when they won the last two US Opens didn’t they? McDowell made it happen when he beat Tiger at Sherwood and won the Ryder Cup? McIlroy made it happen when he recovered from the most crushing blow up imaginable to win the US Open in record breaking fashion?
Don’t doubt quality.
like i said earlier, give me your picks for augusta 2012. i want ‘em now, not after the event when some of you will claim genius status. well??? i’m waiting. anyone??
Octopus.. My picks for the Masters are.. McIlroy,Westwood,Mickelson and Garcia.. There’s my predictions.
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Dave- they choked!! And if they would’ve won you guys would be saying how they are kings of the world. But they lost so it doesn’t matter ha! And octopus tiger will win at Augusta. And mcilroy will miss the cut at the us open. Those are my predictions.
[...] year has passed since Rory McIlroy and Lee Westwood adamantly stated that they would not, under any circumstances, join the PGA Tour, deciding instead [...]